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🌳 TCB Equipment Leasing: https://tcbequipmentleasing.com/
👤 Connect with Trevor Biebrach: https://www.linkedin.com/in/trevor-biebrach-29464879/
📸 TCB Equipment Leasing on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/tcb_equipmentleasing/
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Why Snow Contractors Are Different
00:00
Trevor Biebrach
Guarantee you. And ask anybody who just does snow or does snow removal. We got. We got some nuts loose in our heads. It's an emergency service. Think of us as like firemen. The upfront cost in brine is just astronomical if you want to convert your entire snow operation to it.
Welcome To The Podcast
00:18
Jack Jostes
Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Landscaper's Guide Podcast. Today we're in the Ramblin Jackson video.
00:24
Jack Jostes
Studio in Lyons, Colorado.
00:26
Jack Jostes
I just finished a video shoot with.
00:28
Jack Jostes
My client, Trevor Bebrock. He's the president of TCB Equipment Leasing. And Trevor, welcome to Landscapers Guide podcast.
00:37
Trevor Biebrach
Glad to be here. Thanks for having me. How.
00:39
Jack Jostes
How has your time in Colorado been so far?
00:42
Trevor Biebrach
Very windy.
00:43
Jack Jostes
It has been windy. In fact, there are. There's a red flag warning for wind, and it's like 70 mile an hour winds outside.
00:52
Trevor Biebrach
It's crazy.
00:54
Jack Jostes
It is crazy. And it happens here in Colorado.
00:57
Trevor Biebrach
So that's something we don't get back in Chicago is fire alerts, right? Yeah.
01:03
Jack Jostes
So the cool thing though, about being in the studio, though, is despite how windy it was quiet here in the studio. And we got all your work done.
01:13
Trevor Biebrach
We get a full day's worth of work done? Absolutely, we did.
01:16
Jack Jostes
So we made videos for TCB equipment leasing. How'd that go? How was using the teleprompter and doing the videos overall?
01:23
Trevor Biebrach
Honestly, for the first time I've ever done something like this, it's kind of fun, different, enjoyable. I was a little nervous coming into it, but in the end it actually turned out pretty good.
01:36
Jack Jostes
I thought you did a great job and appreciate that it was fun. It was fun. I think it is fun.
01:42
Trevor Biebrach
I was a little nervous, a little sweaty at the beginning, but yeah, it turned out to be fun.
01:45
Jack Jostes
We're gonna Photoshop out all of the sweat.
01:48
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, please do.
01:48
Jack Jostes
So. No, you were good. And the teleprompter, I think makes it fun in some. Well, it removes some of the anxiety, I think, because you're not talking to.
01:58
Trevor Biebrach
A camera, which is nice, right?
01:59
Jack Jostes
You're not talking to the camera. And we spent a fair amount of time on scripting and then we reviewed it, so you were really prepared. And then it's just kind of reading it.
02:09
Trevor Biebrach
And it's all about editing.
02:10
Jack Jostes
It is.
02:11
Trevor Biebrach
I'm going to rely on you to edit me. Good.
02:13
Jack Jostes
We're going to need to increase the budget for editing.
02:15
Trevor Biebrach
Do what you need. Just don't make me look bad.
02:18
Jack Jostes
There were a few F bombs. There were no. I'm kidding.
02:22
Trevor Biebrach
Well, that's normal. That's just Me.
02:24
Jack Jostes
It is, it is normal. Have you ever seen Winnebago man, by the way? Have not so in video in. I think it was in the 80s, there was this guy, Winnebago man who was hired to do these ads for Winnebago, okay. And they have all these outtakes of him swearing. And the editors would literally, back in the day would like make duplicates of like the VHS tape and send it to their video buddies. And then like when YouTube started, they got on YouTube and it became this like, it went viral comedy. And there's now there's a movie on Netflix about it. But if you want a Mango man. Yeah. If you want some inspiration about bloopers and like, see some serious swearing bloopers makes it fun. I agree.
03:08
Trevor Biebrach
I mean we're all human. We all make mistakes. I mean, own up to them. Have fun with it.
What Is TCB Equipment Leasing?
03:13
Jack Jostes
So tell us, what is tcb? Equipment leasing?
03:16
Trevor Biebrach
So TCB was developed as an equipment company back in the day, 15 years ago. And we've migrated into rentals and we've seen a niche in the rental industry for snow equipment. There's not too many suppliers out there that just rent snow equipment. Usually your vendors out there are contractors or people that rent out construction equipment. And at the end of the year, at the end of the construction season, they rent out whatever they have extra or what's left over as their snow rentals that there's been like a void in there with the amount of equipment needed for the snow industry and the rentals available. So there's kind of been that need in the market.
04:08
Trevor Biebrach
So we have actually started purchasing, we go to the manufacturers, we get big discounts, purchase a lot of equipment, and then offer contractors around the country availability for just snow rentals that other dealerships around the country, your caterpillars, your cases, aren't able to provide because they're not willing to just buy equipment for snow because it's four or five months out of the year, you only need that equipment. And a regular dealer would rather purchase the equipment for construction so they have a longer rental term.
Why Renting Beats Buying For Many Snow Contractors
04:44
Jack Jostes
I see. And so what are some of the. What kind of equipment do people typically rent and who are your clients? Who rents from you?
04:51
Trevor Biebrach
We have a lot of landscapers, a lot of snow companies. There's very little snow only companies. And with equipment being such a capital investment and for you to actually scale your snow business, you need a lot of equipment and it doesn't make sense to purchase the equipment to scale your business to what you need it to. Be that's why rentals make sense for the snow industry.
05:19
Jack Jostes
And so for folks listening, we have people all over the country. Where, where are you guys currently providing rentals and where do you plan to in the future?
05:27
Trevor Biebrach
We're willing to work across the country. We're in Denver, Minneapolis, Chicago, Cleveland. We're all up in the east coast in New York City, New Jersey, Philadelphia, Boston.
05:38
Jack Jostes
So.
05:39
Trevor Biebrach
So we're willing to work with our customers if they're willing, if they're taking on a lot of equipment. Your onesie2z rentals, I'm not going to open up shop. And in Connecticut just for that, we work with our customers, scale their businesses and grow with them. Grow with them as and if they need 10 skid steers, I'm willing to ship equipment across the country to supply them for their equipment needs.
06:04
Jack Jostes
Yeah, so. So in the videos we're talking about how some people come and pick it up from you and then you also provide delivery as an option.
06:12
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, it really all depends what they want. We have local yards around the country. Our customers either come pick up the equipment at their own transportation cost or I can schedule delivery. So across the board we make it easy for them and we allow them to choose what they want to do.
06:29
Jack Jostes
How did you get into this?
06:32
Trevor Biebrach
We got into this because we needed equipment. My dad started a snow removal company, Snow Systems, back in 1979. Big winter blizzard in Chicago. And throughout the years he wanted to scale the business and scaling the business wasn't through pickup trucks and salters and stuff like that. He wanted to scale the business on larger facilities and he wanted the most efficient equipment possible out there, which are skid steers and wheel loaders. So he started purchasing. Started with 5, then it went to 10, then it went to 15. But year after year we've grown and now we have over 200 units in our rental fleet that we provide to customers around the country.
07:20
Jack Jostes
Wow, that's incredible. What do you like about it? What's it like running this company?
07:25
Trevor Biebrach
It's fun. I mean, knowing the service side, knowing what other contractors go through around the country when it comes to snow removal. I know the equipment, I know the equipment I provide is the best in the industry and I like to help my customers. Yeah, the little landscaper that I've been doing his HOA with pickup trucks forever. Well, there's better ways to do it. You could rent a skid steer with a 10 foot pusher or a back drape or a black or a back drag. Plow and do your job. Your HOA much more efficient. So I'm out there to help the industry and improve efficiency with companies that really don't have the means in purchasing the equipment but can rent.
The Brine Versus Rock Salt Debate
08:15
Jack Jostes
How do you feel about Brian?
08:17
Trevor Biebrach
I knew you were gonna bring this up. You're just waiting for this? Yeah.
08:22
Jack Jostes
Is it all right that we talk about Brian, or do you not want to talk about it?
08:25
Trevor Biebrach
We could talk about Brian.
08:26
Jack Jostes
Okay. Yeah. So, Brian. Yeah, were having dinner last night, and I. I like to ask snow contractors, you know, how do you feel about Brian? Because some. Some guys are all in. Some. Some people are not thrilled about it.
08:39
Trevor Biebrach
We've. We've dealt with Brian in the past. I've upfitted trucks. We've had our tanks on job sites, and overall, we just try to steer clear of it. Now, I understand it works. There's a application for it. But in our snow operations through snow systems, we don't use it at all anymore. The upfront cost in brine is just astronomical if you want to convert your entire snow operation to it. And if you have a large snow operation, it can cost millions of dollars. It's just the upfront cost isn't worth what you get from brine. And I tell contractors all the time who try to convince me Brian's the best. Brian's great. Yes, there's. There's an application for Brian if you want to prevent a bond to the pavement from snow and ice works great pre treat all day. I'm 100% believer in that.
09:38
Trevor Biebrach
But when it comes to actually melting snow and ice, I don't believe it works. And I will outperform a snow contract with rock salt to Brian versus Brian any day.
09:52
Jack Jostes
What about the people who claim it's more environmentally friendly?
09:56
Trevor Biebrach
Oh, it is. It's one tenth the amount of rock salt I put down. So, yes, environmentally, it is 100% better for the environment. Is it better for your customer?
10:08
Jack Jostes
Okay. So, yeah, now I think talk about safety and that component.
10:13
Trevor Biebrach
I mean, if there was a half an inch of snow or an inch of snow that fell overnight, you'd have to salt the place maybe two or three times with brine to get rid of that salt or to get rid of that snow. If I were to salt it with rock salt, I go through the property once I'd be done.
10:30
Jack Jostes
So.
10:30
Trevor Biebrach
So there's. There's give and take with Brian and rock salt.
10:35
Jack Jostes
Where does it make sense? Are there certain markets where you think it does make sense and some places where it just doesn't sure.
10:41
Trevor Biebrach
Your markets where you salt less and you're. You're focusing on the environment. For instance, Denver. Denver. It makes sense for Brian because the sun is so hot.
10:54
Jack Jostes
Right.
10:54
Trevor Biebrach
Okay. You're just buying time in the mornings for that. For that sun to come out. So, yes, I would say Brian is. Is used in Denver a lot more than, let's just say Minnesota.
11:08
Jack Jostes
Yeah, sure.
11:09
Trevor Biebrach
You use it for different applications. I'm not. I'm not a. Not saying Brian is worthless.
11:14
Jack Jostes
So. So I'm curious, though. So. So aren't there some states and even local municipalities that require it?
11:23
Trevor Biebrach
Yes. So why do they require it?
11:26
Jack Jostes
Why do they. Because I think. I think it's mainly the environmentalists pushing it through legislation. That's. That's my sense of why it happened.
11:37
Trevor Biebrach
Your EPA is definitely going to say go with brine because there's so much less salinity or salt that you're putting down on the pavements.
11:46
Jack Jostes
Right. And then there's wastewater and so there's.
11:49
Trevor Biebrach
Salinity in the retention ponds, the legs.
11:52
Jack Jostes
Right.
11:53
Trevor Biebrach
I'm from Chicago. And the salinity in Lake Michigan is rising. Of course the EPA is going to say use brine because there's less salt.
12:02
Jack Jostes
Right. So your point, though, is that you feel it's ultimately less effective?
12:08
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah. Yeah. I would say there's applications where you can use it.
12:14
Jack Jostes
So I'm curious for folks listening who are maybe in the markets where they need it, they've got to do it. How does tcv, do you have vehicles outfitted for that or.
12:28
Trevor Biebrach
We used to. Not anymore. Snow Systems does not use or utilize any brine.
12:34
Jack Jostes
We might. So for folks listening, Snow Systems is a snow removal contractor.
12:39
Trevor Biebrach
Correct.
12:39
Jack Jostes
And then TCB equipment leasing is the equipment side.
12:43
Trevor Biebrach
Our rental equipment side, Right? Yeah, completely. Two different companies, two different businesses. Yeah. The service side of the business does not use any brine.
12:51
Jack Jostes
I'm talking about the rental side. So what equipment do people in those markets do they need to rent equipment that need it or you could.
13:02
Trevor Biebrach
I don't rent any tanks or any vehicles with spray bars or anything with that. What we do rent is. So we have what's called an arctic double down, which is a salt bucket that is connected to the front of a schizier wheel loader and uses the machine hydraulics to spread rock salt.
Snow Equipment Packages That Improve Profitability
13:23
Jack Jostes
Okay.
13:24
Trevor Biebrach
So, yes, we do provide those attachments for our rental customers, which is a great if that. It's great for the packages. So if one of our customers signs up a job, he doesn't want the upfront Cost or to upfit a truck or salter with a spreader on the back or a V box, he can rent from us the plow for the skid steer. Skid steer and the attachment the double down to salt the property. So with one piece of equipment, the skid steer, he can plow and he can salt all one job site. Which limits the amount of equipment and upfront cost there is. With pickup trucks and salters and stuff like that, one person can get the entire job done. And that's our packages. We like the packages.
14:13
Jack Jostes
Yeah, yeah. Tell me more about the packages.
14:15
Trevor Biebrach
So we have packages on our website that state, well you get the plow, the machine and the salter all in one package. And our customers have been using that to bid their jobs. They know what their cost for the equipment and salting apparatuses are before they submit their bids. So they know their costs up front which they can properly bid their snow removal contracts with. And once they're signed, they come to us and say, hey, I need this package one, I need to sign this up, submit a deposit. Okay. We'll have it delivered on this date. Next thing you know, November 1st comes in, contracts in place, machines and everything's delivered to the job site. They're ready to go.
14:58
Jack Jostes
Yeah. Tell me a little bit about the delivery date. So typically, I mean how, when are people actually renting the equipment and then when is it actually being delivered?
When Contractors Should Reserve Equipment
15:10
Trevor Biebrach
So it really depends. We work with our, we work with our customers. We have customers that I'll deliver in July and August if they rent. I got customers that rent like 20 skid steers. Well, it's obviously going to take a long time for me to get those, that equipment out there. If they sign up early, I deliver the equipment to their, either their yards or their job sites early. So even though that the rental starts say November 1st, I might deliver the equipment earlier.
15:40
Jack Jostes
So they're not paying for those other several months while it's on their, in their yard.
15:44
Trevor Biebrach
Correct. You got to remember these are snow only units.
15:47
Jack Jostes
So yeah, I think this is a huge advantage of your company over some of the other rental competitors.
15:56
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, yeah. I'm willing to work with my customers on helping them with their snow business. I'm not in the construction business right now. We do not rent in the summer months. That's our downtime. That's when I'm will, that's when I work on my business to help our custom produce a better product and service.
16:15
Jack Jostes
Are there, are there busy times a year for You. And then.
16:18
Trevor Biebrach
Oh, November, October, November. There's busiest when people want their equipment now, right?
16:24
Jack Jostes
So then what's the off season like for you? When, when are you not super busy?
16:24
Jack Jostes
So then what's the off season like for you? When, when are you not super busy?
16:30
Trevor Biebrach
Well, it's probably, well, your September, October, November, those are probably our peak months.
16:37
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
16:38
Trevor Biebrach
Your April, May. That's when people are returning the equipment. So I have a lot of return that we're taking in. My mechanics go through all the machines. If there's any damage, we repair it. They go through all the PMS with the units and then moving into July, June, July or prior down months. In the hot summer months are down months.
17:02
Jack Jostes
So what do you do personally during those months? What do you golf? You golf? That's cool.
17:07
Trevor Biebrach
That's why I don't do any landscaping. That's why we focus on the snow.
17:11
Jack Jostes
It's so that way you can golf.
17:14
Trevor Biebrach
Just so I can golf. No, it's, I love when people say, so what do you do during the summer months? I always, I, I've been asked that question so many times. If there was a quarter for every time it was asked, I'd be, I wouldn't be in the snow removal business anymore. I'd be retired on a beach in Florida. But it's, it's a year round business though. We focus only on the winter months. It's a very busy business because there's a lot of transportation, there's a lot of preventative maintenance and repairs in the summer months. Working on the equipment and preparing for winter. I believe it though it might be.
17:47
Jack Jostes
Does that require a lot of you? Personally, I'm just curious about you running the company. And like.
17:53
Trevor Biebrach
No. I mean there's obviously stuff that there's bankers we have to deal with. There's other stuff behind the scenes.
18:01
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
18:02
Trevor Biebrach
That goes on, but actual work being done. No, it's very minimal. It's just like the snow side of the business. It snows in the winter months. That's when we're working our hardest. In the summer months we're winding down.
18:15
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
18:15
Trevor Biebrach
Preparing for next year.
18:17
Jack Jostes
That's, that's similar to how the industry impacts me and my team at Ramblin Jackson. And so we enjoy the summertime quite a bit. We actually have a four day work week during the summer. Yeah. Because for us it's very similar. It's like typically September through March, we're just slamming launching sites, helping clients get their marketing dialed in to get ready for spring. And then a big portion of our business is snow. And that actually picks up around June is when a lot of our snow contractors are.
18:54
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, you need that ebb and flow. I mean, I tell everyone that I'd rather work my ass off six months out of the year and then take the rest off. I mean, ask my wife, my kids. And if it's snowing around the country and our customers are working, our service side of the business is working. I'm rarely home.
19:13
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
19:14
Trevor Biebrach
But I supplement that as my summer months are my downtime, I spend more time at home.
19:20
Jack Jostes
Yeah, me too.
19:21
Trevor Biebrach
So it's definitely some ebb and flow.
19:24
Jack Jostes
Well, that's cool. Do you have any fun trips planned this year?
19:28
Trevor Biebrach
We actually just got back from Las Vegas Con Expo. We had some of our manufacturers had us out there for some parties and wined and dined us. So it was definitely a lot of fun.
19:40
Jack Jostes
That's cool.
19:41
Trevor Biebrach
Punishing, of course.
19:42
Jack Jostes
Vegas. Yeah.
19:44
Trevor Biebrach
But it was fun.
What To Expect At SIMA Symposium
19:45
Jack Jostes
And tell us, are you exhibiting at the SIMA symposium?
19:49
Trevor Biebrach
We will be there, yes. So come out and see us. We haven't had a, we don't have a booth number yet, but we will be out on the show floor with some deals out there. So I know we're a newer company, especially to the east coast and stuff like that. So come out and see us.
20:08
Jack Jostes
Say hi.
20:09
Trevor Biebrach
Say hi. We are a reputable company and it starts from the service business. We're a snow only company that moved into equipment and a rental business. So it's not like you're talking to a, a construction contractor who's renting you equipment. Come by our booth. Let's talk snow. That's what we know. That's what we've grown up knowing. That's what we do. I supply snow contractors with snow equipment.
20:39
Jack Jostes
I like it. We'll, we'll have to, we have a booth too. I don't know what our booth number is, but we'll be there.
20:44
Trevor Biebrach
Hopefully we're next to each other.
20:46
Jack Jostes
That would be kind of cool. Yeah, that would be. I mean, we, we work with the same people to an extent. I, I work a bit more in the landscape industry where you don't, but I do work with a lot of snow. A lot of my, A lot of my landscape clients do snow.
21:03
Trevor Biebrach
Oh yeah, I'm sure, you know, they all do. Most of them do.
Why Snow Removal Is An Emergency Service
21:07
Jack Jostes
I don't have any clients who only do snow.
21:12
Trevor Biebrach
It's a, it's a big step. Yeah, it's a big step doing only snow, you know.
21:19
Jack Jostes
Yeah, I'm curious about your feeling on that. I mean a lot of the company owners I talk to do snow and green. They do green and white services because they want to get the year round maintenance contract. Some commercial clients will have two different contracts, one for snow, one for landscape maintenance. Some have a combined. But I know that a lot of them see snow as a way to get the green business and green keep their people employed.
21:50
Trevor Biebrach
I understand.
21:51
Jack Jostes
Yeah, yeah.
21:52
Trevor Biebrach
I mean, I mean snow business, it's good money in the winter months. I mean nobody wants to wake up at two in the morning when it's below freezing outside to go plow a parking lot. It's, it's a niche industry. And I'll tell you what, once you're in the industry and you catch the bug of snow plowing and stuff, it's an addiction. People love it. Once you're in it, usually stay in it for life. It's tough to get out.
22:20
Jack Jostes
What's exciting about it,.
22:24
Trevor Biebrach
It's an emergency service. Think of us as like firemen. We're in an industry where it's a necessity. Our customers need us and we have to be ready and prepared at the drop of a hat. So when a snowstorm comes, we're emergency services. We might be out for 30, 40 hours working at once. And the importance of snow is looked highly upon our customers. So it's not like landscaping where if you miss a day or two to cut the grass, you could always come back.
23:08
Jack Jostes
Right.
23:08
Trevor Biebrach
If it rained today, I'm not going to come out and cut your grass. We don't have that availability in snow.
23:15
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
23:15
Trevor Biebrach
Hey, we're going to wait a couple.
23:16
Jack Jostes
Days to clear the snow.
23:18
Trevor Biebrach
If I'm an hour late, the customers are calling a bitching. So we need to be out there. We need to be on our game. And it's a tough industry. It's not easy. It's definitely a thankless job because you work all night and a storm might come six or another burst of snow might come at six in the morning and cover everything up. Well, you've been out for the last 12 hours. But your customer comes in to see white covered parking lot and I ask them, where were you all night? What'd you do? I've been here. It's, it's a tough job. It's definitely a tough job. And it's not made for everybody.
23:51
Jack Jostes
What, what do you find in common with the people who love it? Like who is a crazy?
23:57
Trevor Biebrach
They're nuts.
23:57
Jack Jostes
They're Nuts.
23:58
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, there's. I guarantee. And ask anybody who just does snow or does snow removal, we got some nuts loose in our heads for sure. It's not a normal job. It's not your day to day. It's not a corporate job. It's definitely boots on the ground. It's hard work, it's not easy. And we all have something loose in our heads for sure.
24:21
Jack Jostes
In a good way, though.
24:22
Trevor Biebrach
In a good way, absolutely. I'll be the first to say that.
24:25
Jack Jostes
And that's one of the things that I like about going to the SIMA symposium is just being around. It's different, it's a different show from the landscape shows for sure. And I appreciate the industry. I like the people there.
24:44
Trevor Biebrach
It's a small industry.
24:45
Jack Jostes
It is a small industry and I found that it's a generally pretty supportive industry. Like people are sharing, people are presenting their pricing strategy knowing that in the audience there are competitors.
25:01
Trevor Biebrach
Everyone knows everyone in this. In the industry.
25:01
Trevor Biebrach
Everyone knows everyone in this. In the industry.
25:02
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
25:03
Trevor Biebrach
So it's though it's very big and broad. It's. Everyone knows everybody. It's a small world in the industry for sure. And I like to look at some of my competitors, my good competitors, as friends first. There's many times where I get calls up from competitors, say hey, I need you to help me out. And we have that relationship where he can call me in the middle of a snowstorm. If he's having issues on job sites and we're close by, I'm happy to come and help him. It might not look good to the customer or it might not look good on me or. Let me rephrase that. It'll. It'll make him look better to his.
25:42
Jack Jostes
Customer that he got.
25:45
Trevor Biebrach
But in the end, the relationship that we've built in the industry allows us later on for me to do the same thing.
Competitors Helping Competitors During Snowstorms
25:52
Jack Jostes
Yeah. Are there any stories that come to mind? You don't need to tell me which contractor, but can you think of.
26:00
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, there's many. I mean, I mean I've helped contractors out with equipment service needs, especially salting events in the Chicago area. On the east coast, for instance, this past winter we had two big events on the East Coast. Two big nor' easters were. Rhode Island, I think, had 37, 39 inches of snow and one snowstorm. We went out there and helped bail out some of the, our competitors and customers. I provided additional equipment to some of the contractors out there that didn't have the type of equipment needed for a 30 inch event. I mean, there's not too many contractors out there that prepare for 30 inches of snow. It's a lot of snow. And the equipment that they put on site isn't made for 30 inches. So we ship some equipment out there and help people out. What got you into this business?
26:59
Jack Jostes
Well, so I'm from the Chicago area too. I'm from Arlington Heights. And growing up, have you ever been to Pesci's Flowers and Des Plaines?
27:08
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah.
27:09
Jack Jostes
So growing up, I would do gardening with my mom and grandmother and we would get the Pesci's flowers print calendar. I don't know if you've ever had it, but I think they discontinued it. But growing up, they had this awesome calendar with flower photos. And that was just the calendar in our house that had my soccer schedule and everything. And I helped my mom garden. I mowed lawns and shoveled driveways when I was like probably starting around 12, just doing neighbors and stuff to make some cash. But there was something about getting paid cash and smelling like gasoline. Like, like, I think my dad had a Craftsman lawnmower.
27:47
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah.
27:47
Jack Jostes
And just there is something about like going and mowing a lawn and getting paid cash that was like, cash is still king. It is. We were talking this at dinner last night.
27:56
Trevor Biebrach
I don't care what anyone says. Cash is still king.
27:58
Jack Jostes
It is like literal cash y. So there that, that happened. And then I worked at Pashees Flowers when I could start driving. That was the job I wanted. And I. And I worked there in the spring and summer and I was just an entry level worker, but I got hired back, I think for five seasons.
28:16
Trevor Biebrach
Okay.
28:17
Jack Jostes
And they were a good company. They gave everybody a raise every year.
28:20
Trevor Biebrach
Okay.
28:21
Jack Jostes
And I learned more and more each year and I knew where stuff was. And it was still. It was just an hourly part time job.
28:29
Trevor Biebrach
And you enjoyed it.
28:30
Jack Jostes
I loved it.
28:31
Trevor Biebrach
Okay.
28:31
Jack Jostes
I loved it because they were, you know, I worked with a third generation owner and his dad was there. So there was Frank Pesci and then there was Chris Pesci. And they were their families from Luxembourg. And they just, they were just really hardworking people who cared a lot about quality and cleanliness and customer service. And so we would get there early to sweep the aisles outside and water the plants and like basically prepare everything. I cleaned the bathrooms like, so that was kind of fun. There was like this rush to get the place to look really good before the customers came.
29:14
Trevor Biebrach
Okay.
29:15
Jack Jostes
And then in the springtime, there would be this surge of people who would come, like right after church got out and it was slamming. And so we would be like directing traffic in the parking lot and helping people put stuff in their car. And so it was an opportunity to learn to talk to people. Looking back as just customer service and the culture there was, it was just helpful, professional clean. It was a desirable place to work. Like, everyone took their job pretty seriously there.
29:52
Trevor Biebrach
So from that, did you go to college for horticultural stuff? I didn't.
29:55
Jack Jostes
So I played in a band. So I play mandolin. And around that time I was playing in a band that I started in high school and I managed that band throughout college and learned email marketing and sales by booking gigs and building an email list. And I learned social media by. I was just getting my music out. And when I graduated, we moved to Colorado with my band and I thought I would go for it. We had a house, we had a minivan. Like were really going for it.
30:27
Trevor Biebrach
And living out of the van.
30:30
Jack Jostes
Honestly, went on tour and we, we could only afford to stay in. It was a motel.
30:36
Trevor Biebrach
Okay.
30:36
Jack Jostes
One night of the like seven night trip. So were either staying.
30:40
Trevor Biebrach
Camping out.
30:41
Jack Jostes
Yeah, it was life on the road.
30:44
Trevor Biebrach
That's how you start.
30:44
Jack Jostes
It was not glamorous though, because we did not get paid at these gigs.
30:50
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, well, you're just trying to get your name.
30:51
Jack Jostes
That was where I learned like, I don't really want to do this. I don't want to do this. And I started doing. I sold a multi level marketing pyramid scheme product, okay, that allegedly helped people get found on the Internet, but. But it didn't. And I never got paid. And then, and then the company went out of business. So I had several clients that I had hired or had hired me. And I'm like, hey, I'm sor.
31:20
Trevor Biebrach
Interesting.
31:21
Jack Jostes
And so I bartered with two of them. So one of them was like, you know, get out of here. You're the, like the third. This is the third time this has happened to me. The other two were like, okay, you can barter with me. And I started writing email content and website content and social media. And I was in this networking group. So I just kind of accidentally started freelancing and then met a guy who actually did local search engine optimization. And he taught me how you actually get businesses on Google. And I, I was good at sales and project management and writing and he was good at the technical part. So I started selling and subcontracting his work. And then I'd say, all right, here you go. Now give this to your web developer to put on your website.
32:05
Jack Jostes
And all those people kept failing. And I'm like, what if I hired a web developer who was good at this? So I hired a subcontractor web developer and accidentally started a marketing agency. So I hadn't intended to do that, but around that time, I did public speaking for Constant Contact, the email marketing company, and they would send me to speak at chambers of commerce and trade shows. And they sent me to speak at the Pro Green Expo in Colorado, which is our landscape and garden center trade show. And I spoke and I told the story. I used to work at a garden center and I just could talk to landscapers and I understood you relate to them. I related to them, but I never would have thought that I related to them. You know what I mean?
32:51
Jack Jostes
Like, I just worked at the garden center Pesci's as a summer and spring job, but I didn't realize that. I learned I know the difference between a garden center and a nursery and lawn care and like really basic stuff. And when I started looking at the marketing that these companies were doing, as an example, I had a client in Colorado who does not do landscaping. He does lawn care, like fertilization, aeration, that's it. And his SEO company he was hiring had optimized him and was running Google Ads for landscaping. So come April, they literally can hardly answer the phone. They had three full time people answering the phone. They get so many leads, and they were telling like 35% of them, no, we don't do landscaping.
33:37
Trevor Biebrach
Oh, geez.
33:38
Jack Jostes
And so I was like, oh, well, let's remove landscaping. Yeah, you're marketing all wrong and use lawn care. And he's like, this saved my spring. The number of leads for landscaping reduced immediately. So that kept growing and I kept getting referrals and I kept getting invited to speak at other shows. And eventually landscaping became around half of my business and couldn't get away from it.
33:38
Jack Jostes
And so I was like, oh, well, let's remove landscaping. Yeah, you're marketing all wrong and use lawn care. And he's like, this saved my spring. The number of leads for landscaping reduced immediately. So that kept growing and I kept getting referrals and I kept getting invited to speak at other shows. And eventually landscaping became around half of my business and couldn't get away from it. Well, so nine years ago, I was really in trouble. I shared over there and I was in debt. I've been doing this 17 years. So like halfway in, I was like, really in trouble.
34:20
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah.
34:20
Jack Jostes
And I had a business coach who's like, you need to niche down on something. And originally I was like home services and landscaping. And I'm like, you know what? Plumbers and H Vac and home repair and handyman, like, they're kind of similar in the sense that they work on your home, but they're actually very different industries. And so I stopped doing that. And nine years ago I was like, we're going all in on Landscaping and then the snow part of it just kind of started happening where I like it's branching out from the landscapes that we had in northern states. Most of them did snow. And we started learning about commercial and the same thing.
35:04
Trevor Biebrach
Snow and landscaping go hand in hand.
35:06
Jack Jostes
They really do. So that's how I got into this. And I love it because it works. I like getting a result for people. We track results and I'm pretty competitive for my clients. I love seeing them outrank a competitor. And I like seeing their revenue in a spreadsheet tied to what we did. And knowing that I made them a lot of money is really rewarding to me.
35:32
Trevor Biebrach
No, it's great. It's great. Going back to you in the days getting cash, mowing lawns, you caught the bug just like I did in the snow removal business. And it's tough to get away. You find your little niche in the industry and you run with it. Well.
35:48
Jack Jostes
And what I love about that is a lot of my clients did the same thing that I did. They were mowing lawns for cash, shoveling driveways. But then they kept going, you know, and then they bought a trailer. And so what's the story? Doesn't get old to me that I interview people who now have a multimillion dollar company, but it started when they were 14.
36:10
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah. Mowing lawns.
36:11
Jack Jostes
Mowing lawns.
36:11
Trevor Biebrach
Their neighbor's lawn.
36:12
Jack Jostes
I have a client, yellow wagon, who literally pulled the lawnmower on a wagon behind a bicycle. Like they. That's how they started.
36:23
Trevor Biebrach
They need that picture up in their office, remind them every day where they started.
Technology, CRM Systems, And Scaling Operations
36:27
Jack Jostes
And then the cool thing that we're working on now is more like business operations. So I find that a lot of what I do in my own business is very relevant to my clients. So as an example, everyone should have some sort of CRM. Yeah, they've got their CRM, they've got their QuickBooks, they've got their website, they've got their email marketing, they've got all these different softwares. And what we're starting to do more now is integrate them through Zapier is one of the tools that we use. And then we've created our own sales and marketing CRM that does a lot of those things that also can integrate with LMN or, you know, all. All these other tools, Jobber or whatever other tool you're using. And is that marketing? Yeah, kind of. It's, it's.
37:19
Trevor Biebrach
Well, as a business owner, it's definitely important to us that all our different systems read each Other or work together.
37:27
Jack Jostes
Yeah.
37:28
Trevor Biebrach
Because we're definitely in a transition period right now where we're implementing different softwares to read all each other. In the past we've dealt with multiple different softwares that had nothing to do with each other, that didn't read each other. And it was difficult for my staff to log in here, log in there, and then, oh, I need to pull reports from here to update here. Now the implementation process is a lot easier.
37:59
Jack Jostes
Well, and I love that, you know, and I think that it's a great idea.
38:03
Trevor Biebrach
I think that's awesome.
38:04
Jack Jostes
You know, like AI and integrations can save you so much time. They can, they can do like. And we're currently onboarding a new bookkeeping company and it's been, man, it's been so much work. But now we have all these new reports and systems like things that were doing in spreadsheets and this spreadsheet.
38:23
Trevor Biebrach
And that make it easier for everybody.
38:25
Jack Jostes
Partly. We just reached an amount of revenue where like, I don't know if you've had this in your business where like you can get pretty far with certain spreadsheets and then there's a certain point where you're like, this is a monster and I need to pay for the software. And then you do. And then you're like, okay, well those.
38:41
Trevor Biebrach
Spreadsheets usually turn into software.
38:42
Jack Jostes
They do, they, yeah, you kind of need, you kind of have to.
38:45
Trevor Biebrach
And if there's no software out there, you gotta build the software to.
38:48
Jack Jostes
And typically they're gonna ask for a spreadsheet.
38:51
Trevor Biebrach
Absolutely. Everything starts out in an Excel spreadsheet.
38:54
Jack Jostes
So that's one of the things I never thought that I would, I w. I wish looking back that I had learned sooner was spreadsheetary is what I call it.
39:01
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah. Excel Pro.
39:03
Jack Jostes
I, I think that should be like required for high school students.
39:06
Trevor Biebrach
Did they do it in college? There's classes just on Microsoft.
39:11
Jack Jostes
But don't you think, like, to graduate high school, like, how much better off would you be if you knew Excel before graduating high school?
39:20
Trevor Biebrach
It should before high school. These kids should be doing middle school. Everything's done on a computer now.
39:28
Jack Jostes
No, not preschool, but I'm with you on that. Yeah.
39:32
Trevor Biebrach
I mean day to day businesses deal with spreadsheets in Excel. I mean if I didn't know Excel, I, It'd be tough to run a business. Yeah.
39:42
Jack Jostes
I honestly didn't know how to use it until I started running my company.
39:45
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah.
39:45
Jack Jostes
And that was one of the reasons I had debt was because I, But I've learned and I've learned to hire people. I've also learned to think of things that I want and to ask other people to build it because maybe somebody else might not think of it, but they're really good at building an app or building a spreadsheet. And sometimes I like, I literally draw things. Like, I want a report that does this and here's the data I want.
40:09
Trevor Biebrach
You gotta start somewhere.
40:10
Jack Jostes
And that's how I operate.
40:12
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah.
40:13
Jack Jostes
Like, I draw a lot of stuff.
40:15
Trevor Biebrach
Coming up with the idea is the first step. Searching Google on how to put it into an Excel spreadsheet is the second step.
How To Connect With Trevor And TCB Equipment Leasing
40:22
Jack Jostes
Yeah. Well, Trevor, thanks for coming on Landscaper's Guide for folks listening who might want to network with you or maybe they need to rent some equipment.
40:34
Trevor Biebrach
Rent some equipment.
40:35
Jack Jostes
Where can we learn more?
40:36
Trevor Biebrach
Let's talk about snow. I mean, we don't have to talk about rentals. It's. Rentals is easy. Equipment's easy. Skid steers, wheel loaders. It is what it is. Let's talk about how they can improve your business and help you out.
40:49
Jack Jostes
And it's tcbequipmentleasing.com yes. So this is a new site we just launched from Ramblin Jackson. I think it looks really cool. I love your branding colors. I love the colors on there. You've got a cool process. We're gonna have some videos on there. So for folks listening, check it out. We'll have a link in our show notes. And Trevor, thanks for coming to Colorado.
41:10
Trevor Biebrach
Yeah, thanks for having me. I appreciate everything you do.
41:12
Jack Jostes
Hey, I hope you enjoyed today's conversation with Trevor from TCB Equipment Leasing. And if you're in the snow business, check out his website. And by the way, if you're curious about working with Ramblin Jackson, if you'd like to talk with us about marketing your snow and landscape or snow and landscape industry business, we'd love to have a conversation. So schedule a 15 minute marketing brainstorm call at landscapersguide.com brainstorm and we'll have a conversation about who is your hell yes customer and what are you doing to get more of them finding you online. My name is Jack justice and I'll look forward to talking with you next week on the Landscapers Guide podcast.