Could you use direct response marketing to grow a soil company? What about, how are lawn care companies using robotic mowers for residential customers? Check out today's episode where I interview some interesting people I met at the SuperConference in Dallas, Texas, including how the world's fastest copywriter is using AI to get his writing done even faster than before.
Jack Turk [00:00:25]:
If you think of yourself, I'm a project manager in charge of delivering useful, effective marketing assets. That transforms it, that takes away all the stress. All I have to do is I have to get this asset out the door.
Jack Jostes [00:00:39]:
My marketing and messaging was very technical. It was about websites and SEO. And here's, like, how it worked. People were like, well, what does it do for me? How does it help me? So you kind of need to. You need to speak your customer's language.
Lance Britton [00:00:51]:
You can't help people if they don't know you exist. And so you have to be good at getting yourself out there. You know, there's, you know, many, many smaller guys right there in a truck, and they don't even have their name on it, right? Well, how are they going to help someone if they don't even know who to call?
01:08 - Introducing Danny Wilson from Farm Dirt Compost
Jack Jostes [00:01:08]:
All right, everyone, we are here at the SuperConference in Dallas, Texas. I was at the Diamond Members Breakfast and happened to meet Dan Wilson, who works in the landscape industry. So I thought that was pretty cool and wanted to interview you on the show. So, Dan, what? Tell us a little bit about your business.
Danny Wilson [00:01:26]:
So, our business is Farm Dirt Compost. We turn millions of pounds of old food scraps and wood waste into compost, soil and mulch products, and we focus on getting the biology numbers really high. The magic is the microbes do the magic for us, and so it does magic stuff for the garden.
Jack Jostes [00:01:45]:
So you're the third person in the last month that's mentioned microbes on the podcast. So tell me, what are microbes and how do they help with soil?
Danny Wilson [00:01:55]:
Yeah, so microbes have been around for billions of years. They're the ones who are working while we sleep, while we eat, while we go to conferences. They're in the soil, making everything happen in the soil. So the basic quick story is that plants are putting out sugars 24/7 out of the roots. That attracts microbes. It attracts the right microbes, let's call them workers. So it attracts the workers in the soil that are going to help that plant function the best. So we're making compost that has a huge plethora of different workers or microbes.
Danny Wilson [00:02:29]:
And that way your plant can choose, pick and choose which ones to attract to help grow the growth the best.
Jack Jostes [00:02:35]:
And did you say that you convert millions of pounds of food waste?
Danny Wilson [00:02:41]:
So it's all plant based stuff that we do. So it's all fruits and vegetables and leaves and wood chips.
Jack Jostes [00:02:48]:
And so where do you get millions of pounds of this matter?
Danny Wilson [00:02:51]:
So we work with grocery stores. We work with distributors who are the ones who supply grocery stores. Sometimes they can't get that stuff to a grocery store in time. And we get it, you know, so we can turn it into soil. We get it from residential customers. We do a residential pickup program. So there's lots of them.
Jack Jostes [00:03:10]:
And how do you sort the matter? Because I'm guessing that sometimes stuff comes in, like, do you ever find like a two by four or a broken bottle or trash or stuff mixed in with the, with the compost?
Danny Wilson [00:03:24]:
We rarely deal with that because we have very good upfront client relations. You know, we explain how important this is that we get it right. We explain that this stuff is going into people's food gardens, into school gardens, things like that. And so people are really good. Our customers are really good about source separating, you know, so we typically get very, very clean stuff.
Jack Jostes [00:03:41]:
And then so do you, how do they get that to you? Do you get it from like a waste management company or is this something that they contract you directly to pick up their compost?
Danny Wilson [00:03:51]:
Right. So it's both. Some of them, they do bring, you know, big 30 cubic yard, 40 cubic yard dumpster loads to us, and it's just nothing but cut fruit, you know, other, other times we're picking up stuff in our delivery trucks, either from residents or from the grocery stores. And we'll change out the cans, you know, so they'll get a clean one. We take the old one, you know, that's full, and we go and do the magic with it.
04:15 - Combining Microbial Science with Marketing
Jack Jostes [00:04:15]:
So we're at the Magnetic Marketing SuperConference. You were sharing with me that your customers are both like, you do wholesale and you do resale. I'm curious, are you currently using any Magnetic Marketing principles?
Danny Wilson [00:04:32]:
We are. We are. I'd say that we're getting more and more into it, you know, just combining the microbe science that I was talking about with the, you know, marketing side of it and what people are actually looking for in their soil.
Jack Jostes [00:04:47]:
What's the biggest change you've made in your messaging and in your marketing since learning about Magnetic Marketing?
Danny Wilson [00:04:52]:
I think the biggest change is that we've been, I always talk to where it kind of invokes curiosity, you know, like, what is this like you said, what is this microbe thing? You know? And so in putting it into basic terms, so it's not too, if you put too much science into it, people's eyes tend to glaze over. But when you turn it into something like workers, you know, it's easier for people to understand. So using a bunch of the, I'd say using a bunch of the language that people more identify with who are in our market, you know, so not getting, we don't get into too much into the techno, techno glitzy marketing type language because our customers are gardeners. They're basic folks. So they don't want to hear a lot of this being pushed too much in your face.
Jack Jostes [00:05:41]:
I think that's really important. And that's something that I help my landscape clients do is sometimes, and this was my experience with Magnetic Marketing was like, my marketing and messaging was very technical. It was about websites and SEO. And here's like, how it works. And people, people are like, well, what does it do for me?
Danny Wilson [00:05:59]:
Right.
Jack Jostes [00:06:00]:
How does it help me? So you kind of need to, you need to speak your customer's language.
Danny Wilson [00:06:03]:
That's right. That's right. That's why I always put it in terms of how it's going to help them in their garden. And when they realize that their plants are directing the show in their garden, then they, all they need to do is supply the right soil, you know, the right compost. Then they realized that it's not all this buy this, buy that, buy that. They have what they need if they just supply the right basic ingredients in the soil.
Jack Jostes [00:06:27]:
So, Dan, we've got to go see Dan Kennedy, but for folks listening, do you sell soil to landscape companies and nurseries in Texas?
Danny Wilson [00:06:37]:
We do. We do. We sell soil by the pallet load, 50 bag pallets. We sell by the dump truck load by the 18 wheeler load, and we'll load up trucks and trailers. So. And we're in the Houston area at this time.
Jack Jostes [00:06:49]:
Cool. So where can folks connect with you? If they want to learn more?
Danny Wilson [00:06:53]:
They can go to farmdirtcompost.com.
Jack Jostes [00:06:56]:
Farmdirtcompost.com. I love it.
Danny Wilson [00:07:01]:
That's right. Simple.
Jack Jostes [00:07:02]:
Yeah, it's simple and memorable. You're like ready to do the podcast.
Danny Wilson [00:07:05]:
Totally. And if they want to do, see like a quick overview of the process, how it goes from scraping it off your kitchen counter to, you know, ending up in a garden and go to farmdirtcompost.com/process.
Jack Jostes [00:07:19]:
I love it. You're ahead of the curve here with your soil business and your marketing. I'm excited to network with you more.
Danny Wilson [00:07:25]:
Absolutely.
Jack Jostes [00:07:26]:
And thanks for coming on the Landscaper's Guide. All right, so I'm here with Jack Turk, who is the world's fastest copywriter. Is that right, Jack?
07:26 - Introducing Jack Turk, the World's Fastest Copywriter
Jack Turk [00:07:33]:
Yeah, that's what they call me.
Jack Jostes [00:07:36]:
That's what they say. Or is that, who are they, by the way?
Jack Turk [00:07:38]:
Well, Dave D. Has called me that. In fact, he gave me the idea.
Jack Turk [00:07:42]:
I like it.
Jack Turk [00:07:44]:
He said you should label yourself that because you really are.
Jack Jostes [00:07:46]:
So, Jack, we met at the SuperConference in 2016. I remember really enjoying meeting you and keeping in touch with you on LinkedIn. And you've branded yourself as the World's Fastest Copywriter. Tell me what's changed since 2016. It's 2024 right now. What are you doing differently? How are you using AI? How are you seeing that in copywriting?
08:07 - The Impact of AI on Copywriting
Jack Turk [00:08:07]:
Well, that is the big game changer event in all of copywriting is the use of large language models, ChatGPT, all the stuff, clawed all that stuff that's out there right now. It's just made it imperative that you know how to use this stuff and you build it into your process and your systems and able to get marketing assets done for your clients.
Jack Jostes [00:08:29]:
So tell me more about being a project manager. So you, before we press record or earlier, you were saying, shifting your mindset from being a copywriter to being like, a project manager of marketing. Can you elaborate on that?
Jack Turk [00:08:44]:
I've always taught people that when you call yourself a writer, there's all this baggage that comes with it, the baggage of, I had to compete with Stephen King, I had to compete with John Caples, Dan Kennedy, all that stuff. Instead. And that gets in your way of, like, writing fast. Instead, if you think of yourself, I'm a project manager in charge of delivering useful, effective marketing assets. That transforms it, that takes away all the stress, that takes away all the. I don't have to worry about trying to sound as good as Dan Kennedy. I don't have to worry about that. All I have to do is I have to get this asset out the door. And that's where ChatGPT is so valuable, because now you are managing the production of these assets.
Jack Turk [00:09:28]:
Whether you're writing them themself, whether you're actually generating them, you now have control over it in that respect.
09:35 - Managing Marketing Assets with AI
Jack Jostes [00:09:35]:
How do you see ego getting in the way of copywriters embracing AI?
Jack Turk [00:09:41]:
Ego gets in the way of everything, to be honest, because we want to be known as artists. We want, if you're right and honestly, I want to use the very best words possible. I want to have my voice come through. But that doesn't mean you can't use ChatGPT to do that. You use ChatGPT, A, you can build it so that it does sound like your voice. It's built around your psyche, your backstory, the words you use, the tone, the voicing, the pacing, how you use language. You can build a GPT all around that, so it really is you. But then you have final control over it.
Jack Turk [00:10:19]:
You are, you're like a director in charge of a movie. You may not have written the entire script, but you have control over every shot and the assembling of the final product.
Jack Jostes [00:10:28]:
Yeah, I like that. I like that. Looking at yourself more as like, a project manager of this deliverable, and you're using these tools to produce them for clients.
Jack Turk [00:10:37]:
Oh, that. I think that's, that is the role we will be playing. I'm sorry. If you think you're going to be allowed a month to produce a six page sales letter or an eight page sales letter or webinar, it's not going to happen any longer. ChatGPT and AI can generate this stuff so much faster. So you need to figure out how to build that into your process, build that into your systems, embrace the technology, learn to use it effectively, because people are going to be demanding this stuff gets done faster.
11:13 - Understanding Magnetic Marketing Principles
Jack Jostes [00:11:13]:
And having the understanding of Magnetic Marketing principles and the strategy behind it as the director, as that project manager, is really ultimately then your value proposition as a copywriter, right? Because why wouldn't I just use ChatGPT myself, right? Isn't it?
Jack Turk [00:11:33]:
Oh, I mean, that's the whole thing. I mean, doing this outside of the framework of direct response, the framework of Magnetic Marketing, every copywriter really needs to understand this stuff. So you're bringing that as part of your role as the project manager, as part of the director of this process, because it's more. Again, people got to stop, gotta think, stop, have to stop thinking about this one letter is going to be the magic bullet. It's not, as Dan talked about in today, about, like, Weight Watchers, they don't follow up. Follow up is the key. Follow up is everything.
Jack Turk [00:12:11]:
Building campaigns, building funnels, building ongoing relationships with those clients, those prospects, that is how you do it. That's a much bigger picture than just jamming on one letter.
Jack Jostes [00:12:23]:
What there's, there's a lot of Magnetic Marketing that you're using, that you're implementing, that you get. If you could think of maybe one thing, what comes to mind first that you wish more people would know about, or maybe that has worked well for you.
Jack Turk [00:12:38]:
I think that the key thing with all this, and it goes back to really knowing your customer and picking a specific market, picking a specific avatar, and really getting deep into their heart and soul and what they need, what scares them, what keeps them awake at night, all that stuff. Really getting to know them, not trying to be the be all, end all to everybody. But I can really help you.
Jack Jostes [00:13:07]:
I love that. Well, Jack, where can we learn more?
Jack Turk [00:13:10]:
Writekillercopyfast.com. That's where my blog is, and I post a lot of stuff there and whatever and reach out to me at jack@writekillercopyfast.com.
Jack Jostes [00:13:19]:
Cool, man. Thanks for coming on the show. We are outside with Lance Britton from Sharp Lawn Care. So tell us a little bit about Sharp Lawn Care.
13:19 - Introducing Lance Britton from Sharp Lawn Care
Lance Britton [00:13:28]:
Sure. So I've been, I started Sharp lawn care in 2005. We started, like many other lawn care companies, where I had a lawnmower that I would put into the van and knocking on doors, getting clients and mowing lawns. And over the years grew it. Started adding employees, adding services. Before I knew it, you know, we were doing landscaping services, full installation jobs, landscaping maintenance, commercial snow removal, tons of mowing, and pretty much anything that someone would pay us to do.
Jack Jostes [00:14:00]:
And so you've transitioned in the last few years to tell us about how you've actually sold off part of your land, your lawn, your lawn maintenance clients, and you've switched to using robotic mowers. So tell us a little bit about that.
14:14 - How a Transition to Robotic Mowing Grew Lance’s Lawn Care Business
Lance Britton [00:14:14]:
Yeah. So for the past five years or so, we've known that we want to move to a different business model more focused on lawn health. And so we've been transitioning each of those services, growing the lawn health side of the business, and kind of just baselining the mowing and commercial snow removal and so forth. So just this spring, I actually sold my book of business for all the traditional mowing clients, landscaping maintenance clients, and our commercial snow removal clients. So the only mowing that we still do is through robotic mowing.
Jack Jostes [00:14:48]:
And what is the pricing difference for your customers between the human mowing team and the robotic mower?
Lance Britton [00:14:55]:
Yeah. So it's more of a premium service, for sure. It's about a 20% premium compared to traditional mowing. But, you know, you get some definite benefits, right? So you don't have the compaction of a big, huge mowing lawn mower on the ground at, you know, seven, 800, 900 pounds. The grass is cut every single day. Right. So with traditional mowing. When we cut the grass, it looks really, really good.
Lance Britton [00:15:19]:
And as the week goes along, you know, it starts to not look as good. And then by the time you come again, it looks great again. But you've got that constant change in the look of the lawn. And so with robotic mowing, the grass is cut every single day. And so the lawn looks really good all the time.
Jack Jostes [00:15:35]:
And you were telling me over lunch that you shouldn't cut more than 30% of the grass and that the grass actually likes the robotic mowing because it's cutting a smaller amount of it each time.
Lance Britton [00:15:46]:
Yeah, exactly. I mean, rule of thumb is you should never take off more than 30% of the blade. Right. And in spring, that can be really difficult because grass is growing super fast, and you only get to it once a week. That might not be enough. You might come, and you're taking off 50, 60% of the grass blade, and you're going to stress that plant out. So with robotic mowing, because it's cutting every day, it's only taking a fraction of an inch off. So definitely healthier for the plant.
16:09 - Marketing Mindset in Lawn Care Industry
Jack Jostes [00:16:09]:
So I shared with you, I met someone yesterday who's in the soil business. They make compost, they compost, and they make soil. Have you met any other, like, landscape green industry people here?
Lance Britton [00:16:20]:
I have not, no.
Jack Jostes [00:16:21]:
Okay. So I don't expect to meet anyone else. And a lot of my clients, they don't really like marketing. A lot of, they're like, you know what, Jack? I hire you to do my marketing. You do it, and they. And they enjoy the results of it. But I wouldn't say they're interested in it. But you're at Magnetic Marketing.
Jack Jostes [00:16:37]:
You're at the SuperConference. Tell me about what's your kind of mindset around marketing.
Lance Britton [00:16:43]:
Sure. I mean, I've always kind of felt like, you know, we're more of a marketing company that happens to have lawn care as our vehicle because you can't help people if they don't know you exist. And so you have to be good at getting yourself out there. You know, there's, you know, many, many smaller guys right there. They're in a truck, and they don't even have their name on it. Right. Well, how are they going to help someone if they don't even know who to call? Right. So we definitely want to make sure that people know who we are, what we do, and how we can help them.
Jack Jostes [00:17:13]:
So for many people, they're like, they think marketing is like a dirty word, and it's bad, and it means that you're not very good at what you do because you should get your business from referral. Talk to me a little bit about that.
Lance Britton [00:17:25]:
Yeah, I mean, I think it's like anything else, it's a team. So we have people that specialize in each part of the business. It's just an aspect of the entire, the big picture.
Jack Jostes [00:17:36]:
I agree. I agree. I think you need to be very good at what you do. You need to have a very good product. You need to make great customer relations and take care of people. And marketing enables you to simply do more of that. That's how I look at it.
Lance Britton [00:17:49]:
I would say the biggest thing there, right. Is if you're great at marketing but you're not great at what you do, you're going to be losing them out the back end, you know, really quickly. And so that's where the being professional and doing a really good job is your client, your client retention, and you're going to really keep those clients and then you're going to get more referrals anyways.
Jack Jostes [00:18:09]:
So right now it's May and you just started consuming Dan Kennedy content, I think, in March. What have you taken away so far from Magnetic Marketing that you're either implementing or you're planning to implement?
18:09 - Lance’s Key Takeaways from the Magnetic Marketing SuperConference
Lance Britton [00:18:21]:
Sure.
Lance Britton [00:18:22]:
I think probably the biggest thing for us is maybe a dialing in of our unique selling proposition. I've kind of known what it is in an abstract way for the last number of years, but really been able to put my finger on how we want to talk about it and how we want to present ourselves to prospective clients.
Jack Jostes [00:18:41]:
One of the things that I believe is essential to having a unique selling position is having what I call a Hell Yes Customer. Because the unique selling position to one person might not matter to another. So who would you say when you're kind of framing this up? Who is your Hell Yes Customer now, 20 years in, you're making these big changes?
Danny Wilson [00:19:01]:
Yeah.
Lance Britton [00:19:01]:
So that's interesting as well, because that's another one of the things that, you know, we've taken as an exercise for the company and more because of this is our, you know, who is our ideal client. And for us, we found that it is kind of that 30 to 40 year old with a family that's really busy, that takes pride in their lawn, and they, they like being outdoors, but they don't want to spend a all their time doing everything they like to do some of it, but the other, they want a partner that will help them with the rest and provide them with expert advice for the parts that they're responsible for so that they know what what is happening and what they need to be doing. And then that partnership together really gives them the results that they're looking for.
Jack Jostes [00:19:53]:
Cool. Well, Lance, it was a pleasure talking with you. We've got to get back and see some more presentations. So where can folks connect with you if they want to learn more?
Lance Britton [00:19:49]:
Just email lance@sharplawncare.com.
Jack Jostes [00:19:54]:
Cool, Lance. Thanks for coming on the Landscaper's Guide.
You’ve been watching the Landscaper's Guide podcast. Go ahead and like this video and subscribe to our YouTube Channel for even more sales and marketing ideas to grow your snow and landscape company. And click the link at the end of this video to see the next episode.
Hey, everyone, it's Jack Jostes, and thank you for listening to the Landscaper's Guide to Modern Sales and Marketing podcast. If you'd like to learn even more about how to grow your snow and landscape company, grab the landscapers marketing toolbox at landscapersguide.com/Toolbox and I'll ship you a free bag of beef jerky and a print marketing field guide that'll show you exactly what you need to do to get more Hell Yes Customers at your snow and landscape company. Check out our show notes for that link and I look forward to talking to you next week on the Landscaper's Guide.
Show Notes:
Watch the full episode + see the transcript at: https://landscapersguide.com/podcast/
Tell us where to send your beef jerky: https://landscapersguide.com/toolbox
Check out Farm Dirt Compost & Connect with Danny Wilson: https://farmdirtcompost.com
Check out the World’s Fastest Copywriter & Connect with Jack Turk: http://writekillercopyfast.com
Check out Sharp Lawn Care & Connect with Lance Britton: https://sharplawncare.com/