Jack Jostes:
Have you ever wanted to market your landscape company to high-end architects and landscape designers who then refer your company for the actual installation and construction? While building those relationships can absolutely take time, today's podcast guest, Ian McCarthy, shares how he's shortened this process using a proven method with easy steps that helped him get to over $10 million in revenue in just under five years. So Ian, thanks so much for joining us today. Of course, in business, through networking, you get introduced to people, you meet them, associations and things. What else can people do to proactively build relationships with architects and designers and how do they find them?
How To Proactively Build Relationships With Architects And Designers
Ian McCarthy:
Well, I think first of all, you need to make sure that your company's image is something that would be palatable to them. So you've got to have a website that shows the high end type of work they would be doing, as well as social media. But in order to find them, it's available online, whether you go on Google and search landscape architects, designers in your area, or another website that's very handy is Hauzz, H-A-U-Z-Z, they often list these professionals by trade within your area. And so you can build a database searching online, as well as local or regional architect design builder associations that will oftentimes publish their lists online.
Jack Jostes:
That's great. So once you've identified some of these people and using maybe things like LinkedIn also, how do you reach out to them initially? What are some of the ways that you start building that relationship?
Ian McCarthy:
Well, I mean, I say that it's kind of like a guerilla warfare approach. You basically start out with a nice portfolio cover letter, I would mail it directly to them, I would start sending LinkedIn messages to the principles. One technique that I found that was very successful was going on Instagram and finding, say, my biggest competitor that's in that space, finding out who's following them and who they're following, that would be designers, architects, and then just simply clicking follow. And then chances are they'll follow you back because you're in the same industry, now you've got their attention in a passive way to where they're going to see all of your projects and your posts and your videos, so that they're going to ... it's about consistency of branding, where they get the letter in the mail, the package, they set it aside, then all of a sudden they see you on Instagram and it just starts to permafrost, to melt the mind so that they start to be aware of you.
Jack Jostes:
I love it. I love doing multi-step, multi-media marketing. I personally do a lot of it with, we send beef jerky to people. We send out a marketing toolbox. If you haven't gotten one, you can grab one at landscapersguide.com/toolbox. So we send out toolboxes to people. I just had a mastermind with some of my top clients and one of them presented on how they're using SendJim to send things out to people as well, automated. So sending, yeah, I love it. Sending some portfolio, sending, some people call it lumpy mail, so an interesting package that's like, what's in here, and they're curious to open it. Connecting on Instagram, liking their photos is one thing that I found works really well because most people have Instagram on their phone and they get little notifications when so-and-so liked your photo. So they're seeing you there, connecting on LinkedIn.
So these are all good ways to make them aware of you. How do you then actually go about building trust and confidence that you're capable, because they're probably getting hit up by multiple people, a lot of people know that they could be referred by these people, so how do you actually take it a step further to gain their confidence?
How To Build Trust And Gain Confidence
Ian McCarthy:
Well, one way is, we call it lunch and learn, where you actually contact their office and offer to buy lunch. And so we've often had them invite us in, we'll get Chinese food or whatever they want, and while they're eating lunch, we get the opportunity to present our company, explain our capabilities, explain how we operate. That's just a way to break the ice. Of course, if you're able to see projects under construction in your area, people aren't doing this anymore, pull in, ask someone who's in charge, ask who the architect is. A lot of times when I see a project and I know where it is, I can say, "Hey, I saw your project over on Jones Boulevard," and it just makes it a little bit more personal, rather than just hitting them with a flat advertisement.
Jack Jostes:
Well, I like that you're personalizing it and making it specific to a project that they're working on, and many companies will have a sign or branded vehicles out in front of a job site. So that's absolutely one of the ways. Chinese food, for sure, bring whatever they like, make it fun. So how do you then, after you get your foot in the door, get an opportunity with them? Because some of these projects are hundreds of thousands of dollars, there's a lot at stake for them to refer someone. How do you get in to actually prove yourself, after you've identified them, you've prospected them, you've gotten the lunch and learn, I guess, what's your offer or what are you asking them to do when you present at that lunch and learn?
Ian McCarthy:
I think it comes down to the quality of your material and your presentation. In our portfolio, we have other projects we've done with architects and designers, and we put their logo in there, we put a subset of their plan next to the real picture, to show that we implemented it, and we do this to thank them so they can see their name in our book, but it's also corporate credibility, and that's where another designer sees someone that they know in the business that's in your book, and now suddenly they go, "Oh, okay. You work for so-and-so, that means you're good enough to work for me." Almost a little envy started there where, okay, if you're so good for them, then I want to work with you.
And if you don't have that in the beginning, that's a little bit of a hurdle where you have to be able to sell yourself, explain that you understand the relationship the architect has with their client. Because their fear is that a contractor's going to come on one of their projects and kind of embarrass them or criticize them or not honor the design. And so if you're able to present yourself in a way that takes away the fear of them working with you, that's when you're going to open the door for them to give you that opportunity.
Generating Outbound Sales & Marketing Lists With The Dream 100
Jack Jostes:
I love it. And so maybe tell us some stories of what's worked for you and maybe what are some of the results of it? How did you learn this? That was one of the things that before we pressed record, how did you actually learn this method? Because your background wasn't in landscaping, you were an accountant.
Ian McCarthy:
Right.
Jack Jostes:
Turned landscape
Ian McCarthy:
So I've owned two companies. My first company I bought, it was my accounting client, it was a maintenance company on Nantucket, didn't know anything about landscaping, I dove right in. Over time, we started to be asked to do more construction type things for homeowners, and as we grew, the company expanded to the mainland. We didn't have a steady source of work, we'd have big projects and be busy, and then all of a sudden we'd be looking for the next thing, and I couldn't figure out how to get that consistent roll going.
So I had a older gentleman approach me who was looking to downsize from a big corporate landscape company in Boston. And he explained to me that he was a business developer. And I was like, "I don't know what that means." And he said, "Well, I don't like to call it sales because I'm not actually selling, but I have relationships with architects and designers, and if I join you, they will trust your company because I'm there." And so I brought him on board and we scaled really well after that, and I started to learn about how to talk to architects and things that were important to them, and we grew the company. And eventually I sold that company, and now that I started my own company in 2018, Blue Claw Associates, I wasted no time in copying his techniques and putting them to work, and they have really worked.
Jack Jostes:
Oh, I love it. That's awesome. And I mean, in many ways this could work with any industry, the steps of identifying, some people call it the Dream 100, I don't know if you've studied that, but basically making a list of people and then personally reaching out to them with multiple steps, multiple media. How long, if things went really well, do you think it would take to get from identifying somebody, to getting an actual opportunity to do some construction for them?
Ian McCarthy:
Well, I can tell you I started in the spring of 2018, marketing, promoting. My first jobs were family and friends, word of mouth, referral, referral. But I didn't stop going to the architects, I didn't stop sending things out. I was on Instagram trying to get their attention. And we started in April, but it wasn't until October that we actually got a phone call from a designer who offered us a project in Nantucket, the opportunity of a project in Nantucket that ended up being $1.8 million. And that project really platformed our company, and I wouldn't have been able to take advantage of that if I didn't understand what was the hotspots that they would be looking for. Because when she reached out to us, she asked a bunch of questions and I was able to answer them in a way that gave her the confidence that I was used to working with architects, because she was desperate to find a company for her client, and she was afraid to find the wrong company.
Jack Jostes:
Yeah, absolutely. There's a lot at stake in finding the wrong company. Well, Ian, thanks so much. What else we asked you that we should about what's working in implementing this system for building these partnerships?
Connecting With Independent Designers And Architects Who Don’t Do Construction And Installation In-House
Ian McCarthy:
Well, I think the key is that landscapers and contractors need to realize that there are independent designers and architects, because we have the landscape companies that are design, build, they'll offer design and then install. But there are these independent companies and they spend a lot of time and the client spends money perfecting their dream landscape. And when they get to the end of it, the homeowner will say, "Who's going to build it?" And so now it's an opportunity for that designer to say, "Well, I work with a great company here, or two great companies," and that's where they become your unpaid sales force because our architects and designers will actually go to bat for us and try to steer the clients to sign with us because they are used to working with us and they trust us.
Jack Jostes:
That's amazing. So how many designers or architects are you currently working with where they're referring work to you, and do you compensate them for those referrals?
Ian McCarthy:
So if they're a landscape architect with the stamp, probably it goes against their ethics to get any kind of commission from you because they work for the best interest of their client, and they're usually paid to supervise the project as well. But there are some independent designers who may want a commission, where they just got paid for the drawing. So it's kind of a mixed bag. But we work for anywhere from 12 to 20 on a yearly basis, and every week I have new six figure projects rolling into my email box from different ones at different times.
Design/Build Model Vs. Installation/Construction Only Model
Jack Jostes:
Wow, that's incredible. And what do you like about this model versus doing the design, build model? This is more of just you're just a build, an installation company, and you have other businesses under your umbrella. I'm curious if that's part of the reason you like this or how did you end up arriving at this business model, versus, we've had guests on the show who do the opposite. They do design, manage, where they then manage subs who do everything, and they're purely design and project management. We have some people who do design, build, they do it all in house. What is it about this model that you like?
Ian McCarthy:
Well, I think design, build is a perfectly valid model. However, you'd have to be a designer or have great designers first that work for you, and then you're out trying to find clients for your design team. Whereas we don't have a design team and we're able to take projects from 100 different designers if we wanted to. Whereas if you are in the design, build, it's very hard to get a project from an independent designer because they have that fear of maybe that company's going to upsell design phase two. Or sometimes the company's designers will be project managers and they might get along with the client and say, "Hey, I would've made this round and not square," and kind of critique the designers original plan. And so they're nervous about that, so when they find out you don't do design, that's one thing that puts them at ease.
So I guess for us, because we went this business model, we don't want to compete with them, we want to show them that we're all in to partner with them. But I think it's perfectly valid if you have talented designers on your team, that maybe design, build is a better format.
Jack Jostes:
And yeah, I think it's an interesting choice you have to make, I think at the beginning, of what are your strong suits. And roughly what else do you all do? So you do construction, do you do maintenance?
Ian McCarthy:
Yes, we do landscape construction and maintenance. We use 100% electric equipment in our maintenance division. That was just a choice we made. We own a pool company, a pool builder, Blue Water Pools and Spas, that's integrated with the landscape construction, obviously.
Jack Jostes:
Well, Ian, thanks so much for coming on the show. Where can we learn more? Where can we connect with you?
Ian McCarthy:
So my company's main website is blueclawassociates.com. The blueclawgroup.com is my consulting site. We do host an event in September called Building Better Connections, where we teach this very topic, about how to partner with architects, designers, and builders. We do job site tours of our projects. We actually bring some of the designers into the conference to explain how they want to pick and choose a contractor.
Jack Jostes:
I love it. Well, thanks so much for coming on the show, Ian.
Ian McCarthy:
All right. Thank you very much.
Jack Jostes:
All right, everyone, thanks so much for tuning in to the Landscaper's Guide. I certainly learned a lot about this model of doing proactive relationship building. And I love some of the things Ian said about using direct mail, sending people things, LinkedIn, Instagram, doing a multimedia outreach, especially for these commercial business development approaches, really works best.
And if you'd like to see how we do it and you want to get the Landscaper's Marketing Field Guide, we'd love to send you one with some beef jerky. So grab yours at landscapersguide.com/toolbox and we will ship it to you. My name's Jack Jostes, you've been listening to The Landscaper's Guide, and I look forward to talking with you next week.