0:00: Welcome to the ELEVATE Experience Podcast Episode
One of my favorite parts of going to landscape trade shows is talking with interesting people from the industry. And in today's podcast, I'm going to share some conversations with people I met at the 2023 ELEVATE Show, put on by the NALP. I'm down here in Dallas, Texas and I talked to some great people, including somebody who left the green industry, somebody who listens to this podcast and shared with me why they left for a high paying sales job and eventually came back to the green industry and what their career path looks like now. I also talked with somebody who studied horticulture and is a college student. They're getting their master's in landscape architecture and they're looking for a job, in case you're hiring, and a ton of other really interesting people. So come on in, let's talk to some people from Elevate.
Welcome to the Landscaper's Guide Podcast where we share sales, marketing, and leadership ideas to help you grow your snow and landscape company. My name's Jack Jostes and I've been coming to NALPs show for the last six or seven years and I really enjoy their new format. Last year they branched out to start their own show called ELEVATE, and I think it's really well done. It's a good size show where you can meet a lot of new people and it's small enough that you can see them typically the next day and really build a relationship with them and that's what really makes this industry so great.
1:27: Join Us at the Landscaper’s Summit Virtual Event
So before we get into today's interviews, I want to invite you to our next upcoming event, which is the fourth annual landscaper summit. It is a full day virtual workshop focused on sales, marketing and leadership. We've got an incredible speaker lineup. Aspire Software is speaking on know your numbers, McFarland Stanford is presenting a leadership slot. We've got a whole bunch of other great speakers, so be sure you check that out at landscapersummit.com. See our show notes for a link. And today I'm excited to introduce you to some of the people that I met at Elevate.
2:01: Introducing Anthony Russo with Russo Landscapes
All right, everyone here we are with Anthony Russo from Russo Landscapes here in Kennesaw, Georgia. And so your employees are here, they're laughing. Thank you for volunteering here.
Anthony Russo:
Yeah, we've got an audience here.
Jack Jostes:
We've got an audience. But they were telling me that when you were a kid you wanted to mow lawns and your mom said no and what did you do?
Anthony Russo:
Yeah, I just cut a giant circle in my front yard with scissors.
Jack Jostes:
How long do you think it took you to do that?
Anthony Russo:
An angry 15 minutes.
Jack Jostes:
There you go. So how old were you?
Anthony Russo:
I was 11 years old.
Jack Jostes:
So I love that. So after you did that, did they eventually let you start doing it?
Anthony Russo:
The next summer, I started mowing grass.
Jack Jostes:
That's awesome.
Anthony Russo:
12 years old.
Jack Jostes:
So you were 12 years old when you started mowing grass. Did you mow your neighbor's lawns or how did you kind of get started?
Anthony Russo:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pushed a lawnmower, pulled a wagon to everyone in our neighborhood, I have a picture of that wagon on our website.
Jack Jostes:
And so now how long have you officially had your landscape company?
Anthony Russo:
Officially since 2012.
Jack Jostes:
And about how many people work with you during your peak season?
Anthony Russo:
Peak season, we range between 18 and 22.
Jack Jostes:
4:02: Anthony Shares His Core Values & Why He Wants Working at His Company to Leave a Meaningful Impact
And tell me, when I asked you about growing the company, you were saying something that was important to you is you wanted it to mean something when an employee had your company on their resume. Tell me about that.
Anthony Russo:
Yeah, I mean, so when you see someone's resume and it says Chick-fil-A, it means something. So for us, we want to be on someone's resume, it says Russo Landscapes and it's like, wow, he worked at Russo Landscapes, she worked at Russo Landscapes. This is a qualified, this is a great person, this is someone that has character, all of our core values.
Jack Jostes:
What are some of the values that you have at your company? What's actually important to you with the people that you work with that you want to make sure that share those values when you hire them?
Anthony Russo:
Yeah. So our core values are grit, stewardship, honor. So these are some of the things that are really important to us, constantly trying to implement that culture. Yeah.
Jack Jostes:
So tell me about grit. One of your core values is grit. What does that mean? How do you interview for it?
Anthony Russo:
Yeah, so grit, it's very, very difficult to interview for grit, so you show grit in the field or you can be behind a computer desk showing grit, but you got to be in the trenches to really prove that you've got grit.
Jack Jostes:
Do you think grit is something that somebody can learn from other people?
Anthony Russo:
For sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. If you're in a company of 20 people, you're one of 20 and the 19 people around you all have grit, they're going to push you to higher levels.
Jack Jostes:
I agree. One of our core values is raise the stakes and so raise the stakes is where you might need to have an uncomfortable conversation with somebody, but it'll serve them more by having the conversation than not having the conversation. What's another value that if I were hiring somebody who had worked at Russo Landscapes, I'd be like, "Oh good."
Anthony Russo:
So honor is one of our core values. I mean, it's really simple, it's just be respectful and it's not just ... to go a little deeper, it's be respectful to your coworker, be respectful to the equipment, be respectful to the environment, be respectful to the trucks and everything, all encompassing.
Jack Jostes:
Do you ever publicly praise people for living these values?
Anthony Russo:
Absolutely, yeah. So we have a monthly team meeting, probably should have it once a week, but it's monthly and yeah, we absolutely take ... more recently, honestly, I caught myself being negative in these meetings because it's like, "Oh, we could do this better, we could do this better, we could do this better." And of course that's true, we can always be better. But yeah, now I'm taking more of an intentional effort to lead with some positivity on, "Hey, these are the things we did right, these are the things that align with ... keep doing more of this." So positive reinforcement.
Jack Jostes:
Cool. Well, Anthony, good to meet you man.
Anthony Russo:
Yeah, absolutely.
Jack Jostes:
Do you want some beef jerky?
Anthony Russo:
Sure.
7:00: Jonathan Hampton Shares How He Started Landscaping in High School & Inspired Him to Study Horticulture
Jack Jostes:
All right. So you were starting to tell, me we were grabbing sliders over happy hour and you were telling me that you were working in fast food, you were working at Wendy's.
Johnathan Hampton:
Yes.
Jack Jostes:
So what were you doing, what was your job there?
Johnathan Hampton:
Okay, so this is kind of back into my younger days when I was in middle school. Obviously I got old enough to get a job. I was around 15, I think, at the time. And so I had started in fast food, was working at Wendy's and realized pretty quickly that that wasn't something that I was particularly passionate about. During my time at Wendy's I had a conversation with my dad and was talking about potentially doing yard work around my neighborhood. And so both my dad and my mom supported me in that vision, even when there weren't things completely hammered out. Obviously I didn't have a driver's license, didn't have my own transportation, and obviously only knew ... I had a limited set of knowledge. I mean, I had my passion and there were a lot of things that I taught myself, but I didn't have the hands-on knowledge yet.
And so I took that leap of faith and my dad took me out in different neighborhoods when I was 14 or 15, had me knocking on doors, passing around fliers. And I can say that it was definitely an intimidating experience for a 14, like a 15, 16 year old, but it made me a better person, and eventually I got my first landscaping job. I still keeping contact with that customer to this day, have a great relationship. And it really just started, it springboarded just a whole entire series of growth, like a whole entire season of growth. I started getting more jobs within the neighborhood and then eventually started expanding outwards to 20 or 30 minutes outside of where I was working. And I realized pretty quickly that I could make the same amount, if not greater amount of money in less time doing something that I loved and that would add to my experience, doing yard jobs instead of working in fast food.
Jack Jostes:
That's amazing. So you just struck out on your own, you started doing yard work for people, expanded into other neighborhoods, and then you decided to study horticulture in college?
Johnathan Hampton:
Yes. So I knew that, going into senior year, more so junior year, I knew that I wanted to go into horticulture. I've always, like I mentioned, had a passion for plants, for the outdoors, for the environment. And so really the question was about where, where was I going to do undergrad for? When I visited Auburn and got a chance to see what the College of Agriculture did, what the culture was like there, it really spoke to me and I knew that I could see myself doing four years there. And it was one of the best decisions in my life, I've gotten to meet so many amazing people there.
Jack Jostes:
So you got your bachelor's in horticulture and now you're getting your master's in landscape architecture.
Johnathan Hampton:
Yes.
10:07: Johnathan Is Looking For an Internship and Career Opportunity!
Jack Jostes:
That's amazing. What do you see in the future? What do you think you want to do after you graduate?
Johnathan Hampton:
So that is the big question. At this point, it'd be really useful for me to just do internships at firms that focus at different scales. And so part of me starting that experience gaining journey was through an internship I did this summer with R&R Landscaping. I'm actually here sponsored by them today for this event at ELEVATE, so thank you to Claire Goldman for sponsoring this amazing opportunity for me, and so I had a chance to see how work was done at the residential scale. And so hopefully this upcoming summer I'll find a landscape architecture internship position. Not quite sure which sector I'd like to look into next, but I am particularly interested in public parks, public gardens, so I think I might try to go that route for this summer as an internship.
Jack Jostes:
Cool. Well that's so cool that you came to this show and that you're pursuing this and doing internships and thanks for sharing your story. I'm inspired, and I know that there are probably people watching who would be like, "Hey, we would hire you." So I would encourage you to create a LinkedIn profile, I don't know if you're on LinkedIn, we should connect, but LinkedIn is such a growing place, especially for some of those companies that do more of the municipal work that you're talking about or things like that, and put it out there that that's what you're looking for. It's an incredible industry and it was great meeting you, Johnathan.
Johnathan Hampton:
Yes, sir. It was a pleasure meeting you as well. Thank you for this opportunity.
11:48: Chris James with Perfect Cut Shares His Story of Leaving the Green Industry & Returning With Fresh Perspective & Motivation
Jack Jostes:
All right, everyone, so we are here at ELEVATE and I'm with Chris James, who you've been listening to our show for a while and I'm excited to talk to you about why you came back to the green industry. So tell us a little bit about some of your background in the industry, you left, why did you do that and then why did you come back?
Chris James:
Absolutely. So it's a pleasure to finally meet you, put a face to the voice. Listening to your show was extremely beneficial for me. So I was in the green industry on the fertilization and pest control side of things for close to four years. After that time, I was young, I was in my mid 20s, I started to take some opportunities, kind of chasing the dollar, trying different things, trying to kind of find my identity and it landed me, after a few different sales positions, in a high earning sales position, which required me to sit in a cubicle eight to nine hours a day, five to six days a week. And I was probably in that job for about a year before I realized that it just wasn't who I was as a person. I kind of felt as if I was living a lie a little bit and I knew I wanted to get back into the green industry, but it was just a matter of time before things kind of fell into place and I met the guys from Perfect Cut.
They were extremely driven individuals, we were very like-minded. They were delivering the kind of service that I wanted to get behind and attach my name to. And that's when things kind of fell in place for probably six months of planning for me to come back on board with them August 1st of this year. So just over a month as the operations manager for them and just not a flicker of doubt that I made an incredible decision. It's the right move for me.
Jack Jostes:
What did you miss most about the landscape industry while you were gone?
Chris James:
Just being outdoors, I'm an outdoors man, just being out in nature, having the flexibility to jump from one job site to another. I've always been passionate about landscape. During that time I bought a home and probably those moments of the week where I spent time in my yard, mowing, trimming, edging, working on my shrubs, planting, just doing a total landscape renovation on the weekends and things like that, that was a big indicator that that's what I needed to get back into. The sense of satisfaction I would get from just that instant gratification of putting forth some action and seeing the results, being able to step back and look at it, beautifying an area that wasn't necessarily beautiful before I started. I just get a deep sense of satisfaction and gratitude from that.
I'm a people person. I love interacting with customers, some of them are easier than others. But just having that lifestyle where I don't necessarily know what the day's going to bring, it's always interesting, it's always fun. You're bouncing around from one place to another. I think that it kind of took away that mundane Monday through Friday for me and I actually find myself having a blast most days of the week and you can't really put a price on that.
14:54 Chris Gives a Peek into His Role Now That He’s Returned to the Landscape Industry
Jack Jostes:
Absolutely. So what exactly is your job now and what are you hoping to do in your career now that you're back in the landscape industry?
Chris James:
So we're growing rapidly at the start, I'm definitely wearing a lot of hats. I have kind of a hybrid position, a little bit of an account manager, a little bit of an operations manager with scheduling, getting the guys ready in the morning, making sure that they're well-equipped for what they're taking on that day. And then also doing a lot of sales as well, upselling current customers, trying to find referrals out of them, door knocking on customers to the left and right. We're probably more so on the commercial side than the residential, so we're really trying to amp up the high-end residential side of things. In South Florida, we're surrounded by multimillion dollar homes and ornamental lawns and people who really care a lot about their landscape and that's our target market, is the people who are willing to throw a little bit of money to have that property that looks better than their neighbors.
Jack Jostes:
Yeah, I love that you have some of that sales experience. Do you find it helping you, when you did leave the industry to do sales, is that helping you with what you're doing now?
Chris James:
100%. I mean, I hear it time and time again. I've heard it on your podcast. We're in the people industry, we're in this customer service industry, we just happen to do landscape. So building relationships with the customers, that's key. The communication side of things, the ability to take a customer who's not so happy, help them to feel heard, recognize the issue, provide a solution to that. I mean, that's all invaluable and I really was able to kind of sharpen that on the sales side of things. And I know not every landscape company is bringing that kind of customer service, so it definitely helps us kind of set ourselves apart.
Jack Jostes:
Well, Chris, thanks so much for coming on the show, sharing your story. I'm sure there's somebody listening who's like this close to taking a corporate sales job and maybe they'll hear this and be like, "You know what? I should probably stay. I should probably water the grass I have." The grass is always greener, right?
Chris Jame:
100%.
Jack Jostes:
So anyways, that's so cool and it sounds like you're up to really exciting things, so thanks for coming on the show.
Chris James:
Absolutely. Look forward to talking to you again in the years to come, kind of updating you on the progress we're making.
17:13: Joe Coates of Groundshog Shares How Being a Coast Guard Reservist Positively Impacts His Landscaping Company
Jack Jostes:
All right, so I'm here with Joe Coates from Groundshog Lawn and Landscape, they're in Baltimore, Maryland. We're working together, we just launched your site about a year ago and I'm excited to be working with you.
Joe Coates:
Yeah, likewise.
Jack Jostes:
And to have you on the podcast. So one of the things, and this is on your website, is you're a veteran owned company and I wanted to hear a little bit about that. And you're now in the Coast Guard Reserves.
Joe Coates:
Yes.
Jack Jostes:
And so just tell us a little bit about your background.
Joe Coates:
Alrighty. I own, like you said, Groundshog Lawn and Landscape. I'm also a reservist in the United States Coast Guard. I was 34 years old when I joined. A little bit of background, I was always kind of energetic, motivated and wanted to do things like jump out of airplanes and things of that nature. I ended up going into bootcamp 2011, went through, went to a school, was gone for approximately six months from my business. So somehow I had to check in periodically and see how things were going and fortunately it went really well. It enabled me to rely more on the scheduling software, putting more onus on my men, more accountability, and then just following up with the leads and could others take on the sales process and develop it and grow it and it's worked well.
18:55: Joe Explains Which Team Roles & Systems are Critical to Allow Him to Serve as a Reservist in the Coast Guard
Jack Jostes:
What were some of the key systems that you had in place that allowed you to go on the road sometimes even without communication for two weeks to 60 days?
Joe Coates:
Well, going back, I switched to a software called Jobber, that helped me for a few years. I expanded from Jobber to now what I use now is LMN. That's software, that's helped greatly. I learned key roles that I needed to fill within my business. I needed somebody that could really run the ship, say if I were gone. And I knew that was going to be necessary, I had to find that person. Fortunately I did in Audrey Hayes, but that was probably one of the key, that was honestly the most important thing I took from it. I had to find the right personnel and that personnel may be expensive, it may be challenging to find the right one at first, but it became a necessity in order for me to grow from point A to point B. I just couldn't do it anymore. I had reached my bandwidth and could no longer take on anymore.
20:00: How Streamlining Operations Helps Joe Focus on Team Building & Company Morale
Jack Jostes:
So you've gotten your business to this point. What do you focus on now when you are there, what is it that you do now that you've gotten the business to this level?
Joe Coates:
More networking, more meeting, greeting people, trying to build the team, keep the company morale high, more as a liaison in that sense. The people I have, I can't say enough about them, they're very good and they keep the morale high. I'm more or less there just to occasionally be a punching bag. If something goes wrong, blame it on Joe, so to speak. But that's kind of like I'll be the scapegoat here and there. I rarely have to play the bad guy because my guys are all very talented. I'm a lucky guy in that sense. But more just overseeing things, networking, meet and greeting and trying to develop those relationships because without the relationships, I can't really do anything. So I try to keep them cultivated, answering questions, always being available.
Jack Jostes:
Well, Joe, that's incredible that you are serving through the Coast Guard and able to take that time off by investing in the software, the people and the systems. So thanks so much for sharing this on the podcast.
Joe Coates:
Thanks, Jack.
21:28: Introducing Gage Roberts, Director of Sales at Aspire Software
Jack Jostes:
Yeah, thank you. Right now we're in front of the Aspire Software booth. I'm with Gage Roberts, who is the director of sales at Aspire. I'm excited to have you present at the Landscaper’s Summit again this year. This year you've got a whole slot on “Know your Numbers”, which is really important. And for the people who are probably coming to the show, a lot of people on the podcast are going to come, tell us a little bit about your background in the green industry.
Gage Roberts:
Yeah. So I've been at Aspire for seven years now. I had a great opportunity of learning financials and understanding numbers at a very granular level from Kevin Kehoe, one of the industry's greatest consultants. He taught me a lot about how to understand numbers and really put them into effect for maximizing profit.
Jack Jostes:
So did you get to work directly with Kevin?
Gage Roberts:
Yeah, I actually worked directly for Kevin in our effort to sell Aspire.
Jack Jostes:
Cool. So what is it that keeps you in the green industry?
Gage Roberts:
I was born for this industry. I love the blue collar nature of it. There's a lot of value that can be had in understanding numbers and helping people better run their business. And we get the fortunate opportunity here at Aspire to watch people make big changes in their life.
22:43: Gage Addresses Financial Knowledge Challenges Green Industry Companies Have & How to Solve Them
Jack Jostes:
What are some of the key challenges that you see businesses have that maybe draw them to see a talk like know your numbers or to Aspire in general?
Gage Roberts:
Yeah, I think there's a lot of processes that happen in this industry and without a good system in place, it's very hard to capture those processes, and with that comes a loss of visibility with numbers. And without knowing your numbers at a very granular level, it is very hard to understand profit.
Jack Jostes:
One of the challenges that I see with businesses of all kinds, especially snow and landscape companies, is the delay in getting those numbers. Maybe they're looking at it at the end of the month or at the end of the quarter or a whole season goes by. What are some of the numbers that you think businesses need to be looking at on a daily or weekly, absolutely a monthly basis?
Gage Roberts:
Yeah, we hear a lot, Jack, that actually some owners just say, "If I have money in my account at the end of the year, I guess I did okay." That's a rough way to go about running your business. We believe that you should have visibility into your numbers every single day and those numbers should be, that are visible, estimated versus actual is probably one of the most important to understand if you are both bidding things correctly and operating correctly.
Jack Jostes:
And so a key for that is job costing and then getting real time expenses tracked to the job. Why don't more people do that? I mean, it seems obvious to do that. Why aren't people doing it?
Gage Roberts:
Well, I think the age-old philosophy in our industry is manage hours and you, you'll manage your business. That's true to a point, but what comes with hours is also cost. So you have to manage both of those things in order to understand where the profit actually is. Managing hours is fairly simple, managing the cost with the hours is very difficult without a system in place.
24:38: Gage Shares What Costs Landscapers Aren’t Tracking Enough in Their Business
Jack Jostes:
So what are some of the costs outside of hours that people are not tracking either enough or maybe not quickly enough?
Gage Roberts:
Yeah, it's cost for each employee to understand how your contracts are being worked and what the profit is, but it's also materials, whether you subcontract work out, whether you're using any kind of rental equipment, all of those costs go into profit, either gain or loss.
25:00: Gage Gives Key Numbers to Track If You’re Just Starting to Track Your Financials
Jack Jostes:
What else would you say, outside of those, are some other key numbers that if you could get your clients to do, if they could start with maybe two or three numbers, what would they be to start tracking?
Gage Roberts:
Yeah, so like I said, estimated versus actual is probably one of the most important, but also understanding profit by customer is extremely important in this industry. Just because a customer is paying you, doesn't mean it's exactly profitable. So understanding exactly which customers are making you money and which or not, super important. And then also understanding profit by division to understand where you're making the most money and where you should put marketing dollars.
Jack Jostes:
One of the things that we talked about before we started recording was a trend or an issue that landscape companies will take on a client at a negative. They actually may even know that they're going to lose money on it, hoping that they're going to make it up in enhancements and upsells. Is that a good idea?
Gage Roberts:
I guess it all depends on the circumstance. There are certainly circumstances where that would make sense, but we believe, based on what we see, you don't have to take those kinds of chances if you understand your customer base and the profit by customer, because then you can really pick and choose where you're making more money. But it is very common in this industry to bid a maintenance contract under profit and bank on selling enhancements in order to get the profit back, very common.
Jack Jostes:
How often do you think clients or landscape companies are successful at upselling it enough for it to be worth taking it on at that lower margin?
Gage Roberts:
I think for the customers that understand what they are doing and know how to actually action what they're doing, I think they're probably succeeding about 75% of the time. I think where we see a big difference is companies are very intimidated by doing that, as you can probably imagine, so there aren't a lot of companies out there that are willing to even take the risk. That's why the companies that do have a higher success rate.
27:09: What to Expect From Gage’s Session at the Landscaper’s Summit on Oct 26th
Jack Jostes:
Cool. Well, what can we expect from your talk at the landscaper summit?
Gage Roberts:
Oh man, I'm so excited. We're going to talk all things numbers, how to track things at a very simple level. So you can go out, you can do this today, you don't need to go out and spend a bunch of money to do it. And we're going to tell you about successes that we've seen in people understanding their numbers.
Jack Jostes:
Cool. Well thanks so much, Gage. Can't wait to present with you at that show and have you on the stage again.
Gage Roberts:
Great.
27:38: How to Register for the Upcoming Landscaper’s Summit
Jack Jostes:
All right everyone, thank you so much for checking out today's episode. It's been a real pleasure meeting a lot of you in person. I met a ton of people who either watch or listen to this podcast and I got to interview some of them on the show, so thank you. And these in-person events are great, and virtual events are great in a different way because you can bring your whole team without having to travel and without all the expenses involved. So I'd love to see you at our upcoming virtual summit, it is on Thursday, October 26th. Save your seat at landscapersummit.com and we will see you there. My name's Jack Jostes, and thanks so much for checking out today's episode of The Landscaper's Guide. We're in DFW, we got airplanes for you, that's what we like to do.
SHOW NOTES:
Watch the full episode + see the transcript at: https://landscapersguide.com/podcast/
Register for the upcoming Landscaper’s Summit on Oct 26th: https://landscapersummit.com
Tell us where to send your beef jerky: https://landscapersguide.com/toolbox
Connect with Anthony at Russo Landscapes: https://www.russolandscapes.com/
Connect with Johnathan Hampton on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jahampton0121/
Connect with Chris at Perfect Cut Landscaping: https://perfectcutlandscapingfl.com/
Connect with Joe at Groundshog: https://groundshog.com/
Learn how to get six months of Aspire free at https://ramblinjackson.com/aspire/