Jack Jostes [00:00:00]:
Last year, I interviewed the winner of the SIMA scholarship, Jacob Peffer. He's only 23, and in the last year, he's massively grown his business. So you've got to find out what he's up to in today's episode of The Landscaper’s Guide.
Jacob Peffer [00:00:14]:
So I have three crews going out right now, and I'm actually completely out of the field, and I'm completely doing sales and all the admin stuff. I'd like to get to a million next year, and then hopefully at that point, I'm in a weird position now where I don't know if I should hire an operations manager and a salesman.
Jack Jostes [00:00:31]:
It is rewarding to grow a team and have people working with you. I would focus on hiring a number two person in order to focus on those revenue generating things like sales or marketing or hiring people and things. You've got to have somebody who's dialed in on the operations to make sure quality is high.
Jacob Peffer [00:00:49]:
Onboarding starts before the first interview. Like, it starts from your brand recognition to when they are just looking at, thinking about, like, going to and applying for a job.
01:01 Intro to Jacob Peffer and the Alan Steiman Scholarship
Jack Jostes [00:01:01]:
All right, we're here at the Ramblin Jackson booth with Jacob Peffer, who was on our podcast last year. We met on the bus at the SIMA Symposium in Hartford, Connecticut. You won what was the name of the scholarship from SIMA?
Jacob Peffer [00:01:17]:
It's the Alan Steiman Scholarship.
Jack Jostes [00:01:19]:
Okay, cool. So you were, I think, one of two winners of that. And it's so cool. So I'm just curious. Tell us, for people who didn't hear that episode, tell us a bit, just a quick recap of what is your business and what do you do?
Jacob Peffer [00:01:32]:
Yeah, we're a landscape management company. We do snow and maintenance and residential and commercial properties. And I started out two and a half years ago, and a mentor of mine told me to apply for the scholarship and I won it. So we came here, and the first year we did 13,000 in snow. And last year after the SIMA Symposium, we did 65,000.
Jack Jostes [00:01:57]:
So you tripled your sales?
Jacob Peffer [00:01:59]:
More than that. Quadrupled it.
Jack Jostes [00:02:01]:
Nice. That is. Yeah, you're right. That is a quadrupling. Gotta drink some more coffee here before the podcast. Get my math up. Okay, cool. So you quadrupled your snow sales in a year? Like, how was that? Was that a good thing? Was it hard?
Jacob Peffer [00:02:15]:
I was insanely stressful managing all of those different sites and knowing when we should go out and the trigger depths and especially getting employees trained on actually doing it. It was extremely stressful. But we got through it.
Jack Jostes [00:02:30]:
It sounds really stressful. So you came on my podcast, and you were debating whether to buy your second truck at that time.
Jacob Peffer [00:02:37]:
Oh, yeah.
Jack Jostes [00:02:38]:
So did you end up doing that?
Jacob Peffer [00:02:40]:
So we actually have two brand new trucks, and I also have a car. So I have three crews going out right now, and I'm actually completely out of the field, and I'm completely doing sales and all the admin stuff.
Jack Jostes [00:02:53]:
Wow. That's incredible. And so it's only. You're only in your third year.
Jacob Peffer [00:02:56]:
Yeah. October 10 will be three years.
Jack Jostes [00:02:58]:
Wow. Jacob, that's incredible growth. And that you're already focusing on that part of the business, and you've got your crews going. What were some of the things that you learned either from mentors, from SIMA, or from the Symposium last year that you implemented? What were some of the things that maybe helped you along the way?
Jacob Peffer [00:03:17]:
Definitely processes and systems we transitioned into Aspire, so that was a huge thing for us with me estimating properly and scheduling everything correctly and having the guys, you know, it helps a lot with the process of actually getting the work done. So that was probably the biggest thing that has helped me scale the business.
03:43 - Future Goals and Expansion Plans
Jack Jostes [00:03:43]:
That's amazing. So where are you headed in the future? So you're three years in, and you've got these people working for you. You've grown, you've got these systems, you've got the software. Like, where is the business heading in a few years from now?
Jacob Peffer [00:03:55]:
I'd like to get to a million next year. And then hopefully, at that point, I'm in a weird position now where I don't know if I should hire an operations manager and a salesman currently or if I should wait until next year, but I would like to get to 5 to 10 million in the next five years.
Jack Jostes [00:04:13]:
5 to 10 million in the next five years? Let's do it. So I'm just curious, what do you think life would be like if you did that?
Jacob Peffer [00:04:26]:
Stressful. There'd be a lot of trust in other people, for sure.
Jack Jostes [00:04:31]:
Yes, there'd be a lot of. There'd be a lot of people that you'd have. There'd be a lot of customers.
Jacob Peffer [00:04:35]:
Money would be getting spent as well. Yeah.
Jack Jostes [00:04:39]:
Well, I'm glad that you're aware of that and thinking about that, but what would be good about it? Like, why do you want to get to five to 10 million?
Jacob Peffer [00:04:46]:
I don't want to be able to, like, touch a lot of people with the services that we're doing and actually be able to give, you know, people my age in particular, an opportunity to actually grow a career in the landscape business.
Jack Jostes [00:05:00]:
I think your age is interesting. How old are you?
Jacob Peffer [00:05:03]:
23.
Jack Jostes [00:05:04]:
So you're 23. You started the company when you were 20?
Jacob Peffer [00:05:07]:
21.
Jack Jostes [00:05:08]:
21. That's amazing. And, you know, I started my company when I was 23 also, and I'm 38 now, so 15 years in. And some of the things that you're talking about, like, I have a lot of people, some of them are here working in my booth. And it is rewarding to grow a team and have people working with you. And it is stressful, and there is a lot of money involved, a lot of expenses.
Jacob Peffer [00:05:33]:
But I'm so small and I already see that. It's like, it's just taking so much money and money and money. It's all it is, but it's getting there.
05:41 - Importance of Hiring a Number Two Person
Jack Jostes [00:05:41]:
So cool. Do you have any questions for me?
Jacob Peffer [00:05:45]:
Yeah, it's my stage right now where I'm trying to get out of certain things and handing them off to people. What do you think I should primarily be focusing on now?
Jack Jostes [00:05:56]:
I would focus on hiring a number two person who does number two work for. And the reason I say that is, I think as you grow, in order to focus on those revenue generating things like sales or marketing or hiring people and things, you've got to have somebody who's dialed in on the operations to make sure quality is high. And to me, that's a key thing that a director of operations or operations manager or whatever would do, and they can help you build out those processes. And a challenge that I see in a lot of companies, including big companies that are like three to $5 million, is they don't have, like, a really strong number two person, and that creates a lot more stress for the owner and founder. So do you have somebody that that's in that number two spot or maybe could evolve into it?
Jacob Peffer [00:06:49]:
I would like to, but again, it's always a trust thing because you're kind of, you're literally handing off something that you care about so much to somebody else that has to handle it.
Jack Jostes [00:06:58]:
I totally understand that. I have felt the same way. And some of the things that have helped me with the trust is having a scorecard and having the certain numbers and things that I measure and ways of verifying what's being done. Was it done on time? And that number two person can help you create with you those checklists and things. So that way, when you're delegating it to them, you're delegating it in the Jacob way, you know? And so that, to me, I think, is like, getting. There's a way that you do things that has made you successful and then figuring out, well, what is my way of doing things that I can teach somebody else to do and have a measurement in place to get it done.
07:41 - Coaching and Managing the Team
Jacob Peffer [00:07:41]:
Now, what do you do when they don't hit those metrics?
Jack Jostes [00:07:45]:
Well, I think part of it is there's. Is it a coaching opportunity? Is it a management opportunity? Is it a. Did I hire the right person? You know? So I think there's a. One of my business coaches, Wayne is actually here, and he taught me something. Show me, tell me, let me try. Let me try again. Right? So you got to show people. You got to tell them, and then having those systems in place to teach them how to do it, and then you got to let them go do it, and you got to let them screw up and have them reflect on it with you of like, hey, how did this go? Oh, I realized I skipped step three in the process and.
Jack Jostes [00:08:27]:
Okay, how would you do it again next time? Oh, I'm gonna do step three.
Jacob Peffer [00:08:31]:
You kinda have to swallow it.
Jack Jostes [00:08:32]:
I think so. And then you gotta praise what's good. And so that's one of the things that I just did a talk on recruiting and retention last week, and part of my culture is praising good stuff in our scorecard. So we have a scorecard, and it's like acknowledging good work. Like, hey, guys, we launched this website on time, and, hey, look, we've launched actually all of them on time and good news. And I literally ring a bell in the meeting. And I have prizes and I have games, and, like, I found a way to make it fun. So that way I'm putting a lot of good stuff.
Jack Jostes [00:09:06]:
I think I'm doing this, Jacob. Right. So this is what I'm trying to do. I'm trying to put lots of positive deposits in the bank account. So that way when I need to have a conversation of, like, hey, what I'm really needing is this. Or like, maybe I need to have a tougher conversation. Those aren't the only conversations I'm having because now I'm in a deficit. It's all negative, but if there's, like, one.
Jack Jostes [00:09:29]:
And when you acknowledge what's good, people keep doing it.
Jacob Peffer [00:09:32]:
Yeah.
Jack Jostes [00:09:32]:
So that's. That's. I know that's kind of a vague idea. What were some of the things that you're concerned about that as you grow, you want to make sure the quality stays high?
Jacob Peffer [00:09:41]:
Yeah, I guess, like, you know, the way we actually install mulch or prune bushes, mow the grass, you know, how we're properly transporting the equipment to sites and stuff. I guess those little minute details would be the worry for me to hand off to somebody else.
Jack Jostes [00:09:59]:
Could you write down on a piece of paper, like a bulleted list of how to install mulch?
Jacob Peffer [00:10:03]:
Yeah, I could.
Jack Jostes [00:10:04]:
Okay. So I would. I would literally make a bullet point outline of, like, the things, and if possible, make it something that you could grade. And then I would make a video showing people how to do it. And the beauty of video, like, I have camera equipment and stuff, but you could use your phone. You could. I mean, like, just get it done. And the beauty of videos, you could make a private YouTube channel eventually.
Jack Jostes [00:10:29]:
You could have a learning management system and, like, all this stuff. But, like, you could make a YouTube playlist of the checklist. And that way when you hire somebody in Peak springtime and you're replacing them and they're getting ready to go do mulching, like, hey, dude, I need you to watch this video. We're gonna review this tomorrow in person. And I want you to give me a video. Text me a video tour of your mulch installation after the project kind of thing. So those are just some ideas, but I. I think you're on track and I think it's a fair fear.
11:01 - Onboarding and Retention Strategies
Jack Jostes [00:11:01]:
I have the same fear when I grow of, like, what if they don't do a good job and what if all my customers are angry at me? What I found is having those systems, and in particular, video is the best thing I found because the video doesn't get sick, the video doesn't get busy. When you're busy, like, you're just. It's just part of onboarding. Do you have any video onboarding currently?
Jacob Peffer [00:11:22]:
No, I don't have anything. So we went to the. I went to the precon, and that was all about hiring and retention. So it was really good for me to, like, sit in on that and learn a lot from all the people.
Jack Jostes [00:11:33]:
So what were some of the takeaways from that one?
Jacob Peffer [00:11:35]:
Just like, how to maintain the employees, you know, treating them good, doing small things for them. Particularly onboarding starts before the first interview. Like, it starts from your brand recognition to when they are just looking at, thinking about, like going to and applying for a job. So really the first impressions that lead up to that point where you actually interview them and then having matrix in place throughout once they get hired, that keep them on track to be trained fast enough.
Jack Jostes [00:12:07]:
Yeah, I like that.
Jacob Peffer [00:12:09]:
It was knowledgeable.
12:11 - Closing Remarks and Contact Info
Jack Jostes [00:12:11]:
Cool. Well, Jacob, thanks so much for coming back on the show. It's amazing to see what you've done in just a year, and I'm excited to see you in five years or next year or whatever and keep checking in with you. Where can people connect with you? I think you're active on Instagram, right?
Jacob Peffer [00:12:26]:
Yeah, my Instagram is just @Jacobpeffer or my Instagram for my business is @Greenerconceptslcs.
Jack Jostes [00:12:35]:
Cool. Well, we'll put links to that in the show notes. And thanks for coming on The Landscaper’s Guide.
Jacob Peffer [00:12:39]:
All right, thank you.
Jack Jostes [00:12:40]:
If you enjoyed today's conversation, make sure you like this video and subscribe to our YouTube channel for weekly updates to help you grow your snow and landscape company. My name's Jack Jostes, and click the link at the end of this video for the next one.
Show Notes:
Watch the full episode + see the transcript at: https://landscapersguide.com/podcast/
Tell us where to send your beef jerky: https://landscapersguide.com/toolbox
???? Greener Concepts Website: https://www.greenerconceptslcs.com/
???? Greener Concepts Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/greenerconceptslcs
???? Jacob's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jacobpeffer/