What do the leaders of top landscape companies do to retain key employees for ten or even 20 plus years? Check out today's interview with Jake Harris from Jake's Designs, a multimillion dollar landscape design build company in Colorado about some of the leaders that inspired him in his life, including what did he learn from Mary Kay? Yes, the actual owner of the billion dollar organization, Mary Kay. And how did that end up impacting his life? Plus, Jake and I talk about what we've learned from coaching our kids' sports teams. And Jake shares his number one sales tip. And Jake is excellent at sales. I worked with him for years. You don't want to miss this episode.
Jack Jostes [00:00:56]:
Hey everyone, Jack Jostes here. And welcome to The Landscaper's Guide Podcast where we share sales, marketing, and leadership inspiration to help you grow your snow and landscape company. I'm going to share an amazing interview with one of my top clients.
Jack Jostes [00:01:11]:
And before the interview, we talked about jerky. Jake makes jerky. I make jerky. And while I can't ship you some of the jerky I made, I do have some other really good beef jerky I'd love to send you in the mail along with my Landscaper's Marketing Toolbox that has a Field Guide that's going to help you figure out the top sales and marketing strategies to grow your landscape company. So grab yours at landscapersguide.com/toolbox. See our show notes for a link. And now let's get into this interview with Jake Harris.
Jack Jostes [00:01:44]:
Hey everyone.
Jack Jostes [00:01:45]:
Welcome back to The Landscaper's Guide Podcast.
Jack Jostes [00:01:47]:
Today I'm excited to interview Jake Harris from Jake's Designs in Colorado Springs. Jake and I have been working together for over six years as a client at Ramblin Jackson. We just interviewed a really cool story about some of your results. And Jake, thanks for coming to Lyons.
Jake Harris [00:02:07]:
My pleasure. Appreciate the hospitality.
Jack Jostes [00:02:09]:
So for people who haven't met you, tell us a little bit, what is Jake's Designs? How long have guys been in business?
Jake Harris [00:02:05]:
Sure. So, started Jake's Designs in May 2000, fresh out of college, went to school at CSU, got a degree in landscape architecture up there, and we've been running in the greater Colorado Springs area ever since. We're a residential landscape design build company, and we focus on high end residential landscaping and kind of working around the buzzwords of xeriscape and outdoor living.
Jack Jostes [00:02:46]:
Well. And so for people who aren't in the west, well, I mean, water is an issue everywhere in the United States, but in some states, you don't really think about it. Like in Illinois, I didn't really think about it growing up, and then I moved here. What is xeriscaping?
Jake Harris [00:03:01]:
So, xeriscaping, like Colorado, is a semi arid climate, which is basically a high desert. A lot of sand around here a lot of drought, really. We can go long periods of time without getting any precipitation. And once it does come down, it percolates through the sand very quickly. So xeriscaping, in a very short term is low water usage landscaping. Doesn't mean we're going to spread rock everywhere around your lot. It's using different materials that compare and contrast with one another and using the right plant material that once you get established, it uses a very low volume of water. And probably one of the biggest deals about xeriscaping that most people don't understand.
Jake Harris [00:03:52]:
It's soil conditioning. So we bring in a lot of different compost and a lot of different things before we try to put any vegetation in the ground.
Jack Jostes [00:04:03]:
One of the things that's interesting about Jake's Designs is you guys only do design built construction, right?
Jake Harris [00:04:12]:
So no weed eaters, no mowers during the season. We are going out and we are designing and installing landscapes, whether that be for new homes or renovations on old homes. So one thing we do to fill in the gaps in the wintertime is we do push snow, but we totally switch gears to that, and we don't do any residential snow, and we only do commercial snow.
Jack Jostes [00:04:39]:
So it's a very small.
Jake Harris [00:04:42]:
Super small chunk of the puzzle. Still have a lot of hourly guys on staff, and, man, those guys still need to eat during the wintertime. So we can't just shut down for a week when we get a bad snowstorm and not have those guys get any paychecks. So that's the reason we picked up the snow.
Jack Jostes [00:05:00]:
And so how long has that been the case? So you've had your business for almost 25 years?
Jake Harris [00:05:06]:
Yeah. Going on 25 years next year. Yeah.
Jack Jostes [00:05:07]:
So almost 25 years. And I've worked with you for a little over six, and that was the case. You kind of had that service makeup when we met. Has that always been the case? Or did you used to have a residential maintenance division that you closed?
05:20 - The Impact of Winter Seasons on Talent & Employees
Jake Harris [00:05:20]:
Yeah. So it was never in the maintenance thing. We tried to stab at snow here and there. We weren't very good at it. Honestly what ended up happening is a lot of people left during the wintertime, so I wasn't able to retain a lot of the talent that we had already developed, or they would go on attached unemployment, which wasn't good for them because it's only 60% of your paycheck. And it really wasn't good for me either, because then that raised my unemployment insurance. And when you got, like, right now, a three quarter million dollar payroll, every percent of that that you can retain by not paying unemployment insurance, that's a big deal.
Jack Jostes [00:06:04]:
Well, so one of the things I learned over lunch was that you've had several people who, some of them have worked with you for over 20 years. So tell me a little bit about the people who are on your team that stayed with you for years.
06:18 - How Long-time Staff Members Contribute to Company Success
Jake Harris [00:06:18]:
Yeah. So some of my big hitters in the company, first and foremost, my construction manager, Matthew, he and I have been working shoulder to shoulder since 2001, hired him on at like $8 an hour. And he was just out installing in the field. And him and I really grew this company together. And he's up to a project or construction manager role right now to where he oversees all three crews out in the field, makes sure all the operations out in the field are going well. So he's the big hitter on there. Each one of my crews has a project manager attached to it. I've got two project managers that have been with me ten plus years, have a good handful of foreman that have been with me five plus years, and then have two designers in office, one of which has been with me for ten plus years now, have gotten to see her get married and produce three kids and do all those great life things in the time that she's been working with us.
Jack Jostes [00:07:29]:
Well, that's incredible that you've had all these people that have stayed with you for so long. Why do you think they stay? What do you try to do maybe?
Jake Harris [00:07:37]:
So the number one thing in leadership is being authentic, and that's just putting your personality out there and riding with it and being proud of who you are and being authentic with people, being honest with people. Like, don't hide anything. If something's going well, let's let people know about it. If something's not going real well, we need to know about that, too. So at the end of the day, I think that's the biggest thing of developing relationships with people. It's no different than working with a client sometimes. And obviously, when you've been working with somebody for 20 plus years, you've seen their kids grow up, and he's seen my kids grow up and a few different things like that. And I think the biggest thing is make it a family atmosphere.
Jake Harris [00:08:28]:
Let's be honest. A lot of these people coming in at the lower levels of the green industry may have not had the best life. We get a lot of guys walk through our door that may not have the best life, may not have the best parents, may not have best leaders in their life. And first thing that we want to do is help develop you as a person. That's a big deal. And people just want to be heard. I think some of the best qualities of a leader is knowing when to shut up and listen. And you don't have to do the talking all the time.
Jake Harris [00:09:02]:
You don't have to be given the advice all the time. Sometimes people just want to be heard and take the time to hear people out. And if you want to give feedback, give feedback. But that means the world to people. And finally, it's been a family first atmosphere since day one. There's a lot of different family dynamics that go on. Whether it's a kids sporting event or a kid’s choir concert or whatever that looks like, or wife has an appointment that she can't get the kids to a certain spot at a certain time or whatever that looks like. We support that and we work around that and we know work is going to be there for a really long time.
Jake Harris [00:09:46]:
But dog gone it. Kids grow up pretty, pretty quick and you got to cherish those moments and make the most out of those.
Jack Jostes [00:09:54]:
Tell me a little bit about your own life.
Jack Jostes [00:09:56]:
So you're a football coach, you've got two boys. Tell us a little bit about that. And how does that relate to how you lead the company?
10:06 - The Importance of Promoting Family Time For All Employees
Jake Harris [00:10:06]:
Yeah, so that's where it all comes from. I tell my employees to take time for their family. In turn, I don't feel guilty at all about taking time for my family either. Yeah, I do have a 13 year old and 16 year old boy right now. I've been coaching football at the high school level for eight seasons now, past eight years, and I get by in from the people that work for me. One of the first things when I got offered that high school coaching job was like I pulled in the main, the big hitters in my company, some of the people that I just talked about and said, hey, I don't want you guys sitting here toiling over and I'm just working for the man and he's out having fun. I need to have your guys's buy in on this and if I don't have your buy in on it, I'm not going to do it because that can tear a company down and tear it apart really quick. So at the end of the day, I made sure that they were all on board with it as well.
Jake Harris [00:11:08]:
And I think they've seen me become a better leader. There's a lot of things that I've learned through coaching that I can translate to business, and there's a lot of things that I've learned in my business that I've been able to translate through coaching, giving me a little bit better leg up in both forums.
Jack Jostes [00:11:29]:
You actually inspired me to become a coach.
Jake Harris [00:11:31]:
Did I really? Yeah.
11:31 - Business Lessons from Coaching Kids Sports
Jack Jostes [00:11:32]:
For real? I haven't told you this, actually, I did call you, or I think maybe after I had taken it, but last year.
Jake Harris [00:11:39]:
That's right.
Jack Jostes [00:09:52]:
So I have two boys and one of them plays soccer. They were planning to join the team, and I think it was the U-8 team. And so we get some emails and my wife forwarded them to me from the league, like, oh, we need a coach, coach. I'm like, I honestly wasn't the best soccer player, but I did play through, I think, sophomore year, and I started when I was five or six. But then we got an email like.
Jack Jostes [00:12:12]:
Hey, if we don't have a coach.
Jack Jostes [00:12:11]:
We're going to have to close the team. And I'm like, yeah, well, I just can't let that happen. And I thought partly about, we've had you on the podcast before, talking about coaching your team and finding a way to take the time away from your business to do that.
Jake Harris [00:12:28]:
Sure.
Jack Jostes [00:12:28]:
So I wanted to let you know on the show. It's funny how people, the people that you have, your clients, your employees, the people that impact your life. But one of the things that happened on the first day of coaching that was hilarious was this kid. Within the first 2 minutes of the first day of practice, this kid comes up to me and says, hey, you're a dummy.
Jack Jostes [00:12:57]:
Love it. Love it.
Jack Jostes [00:12:59]:
Part of me was like, that's hilarious, right? And then the other part of me is like, you cannot call. And I just basically said, look, I am your coach. You cannot call me that. And that was my reaction.
Jake Harris [00:13:13]:
That's perfect.
Jack Jostes [00:13:14]:
Okay, thanks. And then this kid was causing trouble. So I created the tree of reflection, where you had to run to this tree and reflect on what you did. And they thought that was hilarious.
Jake Harris [00:13:27]:
Absolutely.
Jack Jostes [00:13:28]:
They thought that was hilarious. And so they ran there and they were laughing. And the next practice, I said, look, the new tree is that one over there. And they were like, that's far away.
Jake Harris [00:13:40]:
Far perfect.
Jack Jostes [00:13:43]:
So that was a good experience. One of the other things that came out of coaching that I recognized was and I don't know what it's. It's probably different at the high school level. And obviously the kids are older, but they were just wild at the first soccer game, the kids who were on the bench, because at this age, the coaches are also the volunteer referees trying to coach my team and a ref. And these kids are just going wild behind me. Eventually somebody brought a bench and I bought my own bench. And I found that giving them a bench to sit on solved the problem.
Jake Harris [00:14:22]:
Because it was not any different at high school. We have a get back guy on the sidelines. Can't be too close to the sidelines, right? We have a guy, that's all he does is walk back up and down the sidelines. Get back, get back. He's our get back guy.
Jack Jostes [00:14:34]:
Okay, well, that's hilarious that you still have to do that with them. The rule is if you want to play, you need to sit in the order. I'm going to call people in sitting at this side of the bench. So if you get up and kick someone's soccer ball back, I'm going to have the other kids move closer. They're going to be at the back of the bench.
Jake Harris [00:14:55]:
Perfect.
Jack Jostes [00:14:56]:
That's a somewhat self regulating system.
Jake Harris [00:14:59]:
Are you going to do it again this season?
Jack Jostes [00:15:01]:
Yeah, definitely.
Jake Harris [00:15:01]:
Perfect. Yeah. So here's your biggest payoff from being a coach. Whenever you see, you're going to see some of these kids ten years down the road around town and they're going to say, hey, coach, it's the best thing in the world, man. Yeah, I got kids coming back that I've coached for eight years ago and now they're coming back. And I just ran into two of them at the local brewery and I was like, I'm 23, coach. Okay, then have yourself a beer.
Jack Jostes [00:15:31]:
That's hilarious. So your wife is a teacher? My wife was a public school teacher prior to us having kids and that was a while ago. Some of the students that she had that were like 7th graders are now 23 or whatever and they see working places or out at a bar or whatever.
Jake Harris [00:15:53]:
Yeah, it's cool.
Jack Jostes [00:15:54]:
So I'm curious, who are some of the leaders that inspired you? Who were some of the people who helped you become who you are?
16:02: Jake’s Top 2 Influencers: His Mom & Mary Kay
Jake Harris [00:16:02]:
Yeah, I got two main ones that come to mind right off the top of my head. First one is super easy. My mom, she had a 38 year career in Mary Kay cosmetics. And I saw her lead people since I was two years old. She started Mary Kay when I was one and a half and went to sales meetings with her, overheard her on the phone talking to her people. One thing she taught me is people want to be heard. People want to be heard. And sometimes that's all you got to do is sit there and listen.
Jake Harris [00:16:41]:
Another thing that she taught me at a very high level is success is not very sweet if you're alone. So she was really good at grabbing people along the way. As she was climbing the ladder of success, she grabbed a lot of different people along the way and climbed that ladder with them. And it was a very symbiotic relationship, which is a big deal. And she ended up 38 year career in that company. And when she retired, she was top ten in the entire company to the point where I had dinner at the Mary Kay's house when I was, like, 13 years old.
Jack Jostes [00:17:24]:
That's incredible. Where was that?
Jake Harris [00:17:25]:
It was down in Dallas, Texas. And remember it like it was yesterday.
Jack Jostes [00:17:30]:
Did you drive a pink cadillac there?
Jake Harris [00:17:32]:
We flew, but I had been in a pink Cadillac since I was about three years old. And it was dad pick me up from football practice in middle school, but don't pick me up in that pink cadillac. And what did dad show up in - the pink cadillac? Good character development there, but I'll remember it like it was yesterday. And this is a wonderful story of leadership through Mary Kay's eyes. But I went down to Dallas, and my mom was one of the tops in the company, and we were able to go to Mary Kay's house for a dinner. She had this big pool in her backyard, and it had big old plate glass all the way across it, and all the dinner settings were on top of that plate glass. So we ate dinner floating on top of a pool that night, which was really cool. And then I was touring her house, and she had, like, I was in her office/library, and Mary Kay took the time sit with a 13 year old kid and have a conversation with me, which was.
Jake Harris [00:18:33]:
That was a big deal. I mean, she was the leader of a multibillion dollar company and took the time to talk to a 13 year old kid. But one of the biggest things that I remember is Mary Kay. Every single one of these trips, my mom would bring home a handwritten letter from Mary Kay. She would think of me every time on these trips, and she would write me a happy birthday letter. Thank you for sharing your mom with us. I know it's your birthday. It was on the hotel stationary of wherever they were staying at.
Jake Harris [00:19:02]:
And she would slide that to my mom and say, make sure that Jake gets this like a leader of a multi billion dollar company. That was a huge deal.
Jack Jostes [00:19:08]:
That's incredible.
Jake Harris [00:19:09]:
Huge deal. And probably the second person stop me if I'm going too long was the guy that got me into high school coaching, Tom Pullford. He taught me, just, again, get your people involved. As a leader, you don't have to have all the answers. You don't have to be the direction guy at all times. Get your people involved in that. Give them ownership of that and they're going to help you lead. Right.
19:39 - Empowering Leaders through Sharing Responsibilities for Team Goals
Jake Harris [00:19:39]:
Even though you're the leader-leader. Give them responsibilities and get their input. So I'm proud to say that in the last eight years of coaching, we've been to the state title game five times. We've won it three times. I think that's a big deal. But before we got to that first title game, Coach Pullford pulled all the kids in and said, what is it going to take for us to get to the motherland? What is it going to take for us to reach that goal of winning a state title? And he let the kids figure it out. And it came down to we need at least 85% of all workouts to be attended.
Jake Harris [00:20:23]:
Like, everybody needs 85% of all the workouts from now until when we start the next season. It was the end of the 2016 season and we're looking forward to the 2017 season, he said, from now until the 2017 season starts, we need everybody in here. 80% of all workouts. It was 80 or 85, I can't remember. But those kids stuck to it. They made that up and said it's going to take that and then they stuck to it. Next year we won a state title. So giving people ownership.
Jack Jostes [00:20:57]:
What was the attendance rate prior to that?
Jake Harris [00:21:00]:
I couldn't tell you. I wasn't there very long before that.
Jack Jostes [00:21:03]:
Counting at people started showing up and then you guys won. So do you do anything like that with your landscape employees?
Jake Harris [00:21:11]:
We do something a little kind of like that. We call it an AB award. It's $50 a week. We do it for every single crew. And AB came from going above and beyond. Somebody's going above and beyond. We have an AB box in our warehouse that anybody could write a little and we've got scrap paper next to it. And anybody can write a note and say so and so was asked to do this.
Jake Harris [00:21:37]:
He ended up doing this, this and this, and he did a really nice, fine job on it. And he went above and beyond what he was supposed to do and put it in a box. So like every week show up on a job site with $50 cash and make a big deal out of it. So and so did this. This week. They went above and beyond AB. Atta boy goes on and on and hand them $50 cash to start out their weekend.
Jack Jostes [00:22:01]:
I love it.
Jake Harris [00:22:02]:
Yeah.
Jack Jostes [00:22:02]:
That's so cool. Do you know that we have a beef jerky club?
Jake Harris [00:22:06]:
I do know about your beef jerky club.
Jack Jostes [00:22:10]:
We have a beef jerky club and every week we nominate people, and then every month there's a winner. If you've been nominated the most and you get to pick a prize on the bingo board. And we have a quarterly prize. We have an annual prize. Lou Divers, our web developer, won that annual prize. I'm so stoked we have one also. We celebrate who nominates the most? Gotcha person. We have a prize where we then donate to a nonprofit in their honor.
Jake Harris [00:22:41]:
Oh, that's neat.
Jack Jostes [00:22:42]:
So I think those weekly games, they're kind of games. But they're rewarding. I think I really like them because, well, let's face it, no one's going to do everything for $50.
Jake Harris [00:22:58]:
Right.
Jack Jostes [00:22:58]:
But being acknowledged for it and then having a little system to acknowledge other people is all of it. In the last year, I've gotten really focused on weekly. Honestly, just a daily habit and then a weekly habits. So I do have quarterly rocks. These are 90 day projects and annual goals. And I have an idea where. But I've really found, personally, that when I focus on winning the day and winning the week, that that's what produces the result.
Jake Harris [00:23:32]:
Totally builds on one another. Absolutely.
23:34 - How Understanding Customer's Pain and Pleasure Leads to Closing More Sales
Jack Jostes [00:23:34]:
What are some of the things that you always do when you're selling that you would manage, if you were managing a salesperson, that you would want to make sure that they would do. What are some of your top sales behaviors?
Jake Harris [00:23:48]:
Oh, top sales behavior. Too easy. Ask questions. Shut up. It's too easy. Ask questions and shut up. And people love to talk. Right.
Jake Harris [00:24:01]:
They will tell you beyond anything that you need to know, make sure you grab those gems out of what they're saying. So what I heard your pain was and repeat that back to them. And it keeps that conversation going. Nobody wants to know how many awards you've won. Nobody wants to know how many great Google reviews you have. They probably already know that because they've already called you. Right? So that part of the sale is over, but it's asking open ended questions and just being quiet after that and really listening to somebody what they're saying and what their pains are. The people only buy for two different reasons, right?
Jake Harris [00:24:40]:
Pain and pleasure. It's the only two reasons you buy things and are they buying it? Are they redoing their landscape because they're having a big wedding coming up. Do they have drainage problems and their basement keeps flooding? Do they have a brand new home and their HOA is on their tail because they haven't got their landscape? What is their pain? Where's their pleasure? What do they want? Just listen and that'll come out to you and then kind of associate with them after that and put a few little points to where you can either fix their pain or provide their pleasure. And after that, the sale gets pretty easy.
Jack Jostes [00:25:26]:
I agree. I agree. Shut up and listen is pretty good. So I'm curious. So you've had your company for almost 25 years.
Jake Harris [00:25:36]:
Getting there.
Jack Jostes [00:25:36]:
Where are you heading? What's your vision of Jake's Designs heading?
25:40 - Jake Shares His Plans for the Future of his Landscape Company
Jake Harris [00:25:40]:
So, I like where I'm at, still want to grow. I feel like we've milked as much revenue as we can out of each crew that we have. We run three crews and I think there's like a cap to a revenue that you could. We run those guys hard, like, we treat them well, but we run hard. So at the end of the day, I think adding additional crews for additional revenue would be a goal. Always have plenty of work. Now, we've worked with Ramblin Jackson as long as we, you know, adding those key pieces, continuing to develop leadership and guys that can handle the different positions always like to promote from within. Like I said, project manager started out lowest of the rung and now he's second in the company under me. So at the end of the day, want to continue to develop really good talent and make this thing sellable at the end of the day, because I'm not going to do it forever.
Jake Harris [00:26:39]:
I'm 48. I plan on retiring by the time I'm 60. I'm starting to investigate my ten year exit plan right now and starting to get those things in order. So continue to build it and then at the end of the day, have something to sell and live a really nice retirement.
Jack Jostes [00:26:57]:
Well, Jake, thanks so much for coming on the show. Sharing some of your stories about sales and leadership. So for people listening who want to connect with you or check out your website, how can we connect with you?
Jake Harris [00:27:09]:
Super easy. www.jakesdesigns.com make sure Jake's Designs is plural. There in the middle. Yeah, you can pretty much find anything you need to know about us and there's plenty of contacts. I love sharing business trades, business secrets with people who aren't in my region and aren't my competitors. So, like, if you're in Georgia and want to talk to a landscape guy in Colorado, and maybe you're just starting out and maybe you want a few pointers. Love to have those conversations with people. Like I said, watch my mom take people around her as she was climbing the ladder of success and bring people climb.
Jake Harris [00:27:50]:
She lifted as she climbed. So I like to do the same.
Jack Jostes [00:27:54]:
Well, I want to comment on what you just said there, because you are also one of the reasons why we became a green industry focused marketing company. I'm not kidding. We met because I spoke at the ProGreen Expo in Colorado, and that was because I was working with Constant Contact. They brought me in to speak at that show. I used to work at a garden center in high school. I didn't really think of it as the green industry. It was like a summer job. But I loved that job.
Jack Jostes [00:28:29]:
I loved working there in the spring and summer, and I shared that story, and I could talk with landscape professionals and talk with garden center people. I got some clients at that show, and then they referred me, and your story helped me get some other clients. And then a few years into it, I was, like, feeling like, you know what? I really want to go for the landscape industry. And my wife, we were at this apple orchard, and she's like, why didn't you just do it? You've been telling me this for years. And I was looking, I exported all my clients from Quickbooks, and I was looking for patterns and things. But what you just said about, like, hey, I'm happy to talk with other people. That's part of the spirit of the green industry. It's really the culture of the green industry, and it's not that way in other industries.
Jake Harris [00:29:20]:
Yeah, I could see that.
Jack Jostes [00:29:23]:
And that's what I love about running this podcast, is getting to talk to people who are, like, sharing what's working and putting themselves out there. So thank you for doing that. And you were just part of, it's not like, oh, it's all Jake.
Jack Jostes [00:29:38]:
For sure.
Jack Jostes [00:29:40]:
People like you. I have many clients who have that trait, and it's what I enjoy about the industry.
Jake Harris [00:29:46]:
That's awesome.
Jack Jostes [00:29:46]:
So thank you for being you and for working with us.
Jake Harris [00:29:49]:
Well, thanks for everything you've done for me. You're a big deal in my business, and probably not where I'm at without you, man.
Jack Jostes [00:29:55]:
Well, thank you.
Jack Jostes [00:29:19]:
Yeah, thanks so much for checking out today's interview. It was a real pleasure talking to Jake because I always learn so much from him. I think he's a really inspiring guy. And I love working with people like Jake because the impact is so big. Jake coaches his football teams. He has this team of people, and that feels rewarding to know that way that we work with people like Jake, we're impacting many people. If you're looking for a marketing team that'll help you increase your impact, help you get more of your personal time, help you reach the right people, we'd love to send you our Marketing Toolbox. It's full of inspiring stories.
Jack Jostes [00:30:34]:
People like Jake are featured in it, and we'll include some beef jerky, too. So check it out. Landscapersguide.com/toolbox my name is Jack Jostes. Thanks for watching or listening today. I look forward to talking with you next week on The Landscaper's Guide.
Show Notes:
Watch the full episode + see the transcript at: https://landscapersguide.com/podcast/
Tell us where to send your beef jerky: https://landscapersguide.com/toolbox
Connect with Jake & check out his website here: http://jakesdesigns.com