Connect With Today’s Guest:
🌳 Unconventional Organisation: https://www.unconventionalorganisation.com/
👤 Connect with Skye Waterson:https://nz.linkedin.com/in/skye-waterson-026286204
📸Skye Waterson on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/unconventionalorganisation/
🏢 ADHD Skills Lab podcast: https://www.unconventionalorganisation.com/theadhdskillslab
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Why Entrepreneurs With ADHD Love Starting Businesses
00:00
Skye Waterson
Dopamine is essentially a chemical that is related to rewards and feeling good and feeling positive. People who have ADHD or ADD are more likely to start something. So what we do instead, in terms of the dopamine dial, is we want to go ahead and we want to dial our dopamine down.
00:20
Jack Jostes
Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Landscaper's Guide podcast. Today I'm excited to have Sky Waterson. She's an ADHD researcher, coach, and founder of Unconventional Conventional Organization, which is a global practice that helps entrepreneurs with ADHD build systems that actually work for their brains. And by listening today, you're going to learn a tool called the prioritization filter. So make sure you stay to the end and finish the podcast, because Skye's got a lot of different tools. She's going to share one of them today. And she was actually diagnosed during her own doctorate, and she now hosts the ADHD Skills Lab podcast and works with founders worldwide. So today we're going to talk specifically about ADHD in the landscaping industry. And, sky, thanks so much for coming on the Landscaper's Guide.
01:13
Skye Waterson
Thanks so much. It's great to be here.
Skye Waterson’s ADHD Diagnosis Story
01:16
Jack Jostes
So, so tell us a little bit. Where are you right now? Because we need to pick a specific time, and it's three o' clock, Mountain time in Colorado. Where are you and what time is it there?
01:27
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so I am in New Zealand. I am in New Zealand. It is 9am Tomorrow for you. But I will say I mostly work with clients in the. Usually around the New York area, Grady, New York area. So I'm very familiar with your systems.
01:45
Jack Jostes
That makes sense. Yeah, that's just kind of a neat detail. We actually connected on Instagram, which is pretty neat. And tell us a little bit about your background.
01:58
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so I have an academic background. I never expected to be doing this job. I was a, you know, I went through psychology and sociology and. And health, and I was doing my doctorate when I realized that I really struggled with some of the organizational systems and I was really burning out. So I went to my university's learning center and I said, look, just help me. Do I have dyslexia? Like, what's happening? And they came back and they said, yeah, we need you to get tested for adhd. Which was a really big surprise. And. And sure enough, I have ADHD. And that really threw me. It was about 2018, so it was. It was early for, like, the widespread knowledge of ADHD we have today. And so it really made me go into the research, which is obviously what I was doing.
02:45
Skye Waterson
And start researching, what is this, how does it work? And then how does it work for people who are, you know, doing well but struggling? I think that's the, that's kind of the weird combo that you can have sometimes. And, and I started developing resources and systems based on what I learned in the research and started sharing that online. And, and that's really how I developed the business that I have today.
Why Landscapers And Entrepreneurs Often Have ADHD Traits
03:13
Jack Jostes
And, and tell me a little bit, have you worked specifically with landscape professionals?
03:18
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so I've worked. A lot of the work I do now is I am a mentor slash operator. So if you think of me as like a fractional mentor slash operator, I work with people who are in landscaping, I work with people who are in construction. I have clients in irrigation, any of those sort of trades businesses, and particularly service businesses is the groups that I work with. And what we do is that we help you understand why there's that struggle. Because we know from the research that people who run businesses are like, it's an order of magnitude. It's like 300 times more likely to be an entrepreneur. It's a lot. And, sorry, 300 times more likely to have ADHD. It's.
04:04
Jack Jostes
Oh, wait, wait. So entrepreneurs are 300 times more likely to have ADHD?
04:10
Skye Waterson
It depends on the stats that you read. So in some cases they're like 50% more likely to try to become an entrepreneur. Some have it higher, some have it lower. But we know that when you look at the general population, you've got this sort of, you know, 7 to 8, you know, kind of percentage down there for ADHD. But when you look at it across entrepreneurs, that number is far higher. And when you introduce subclinical adhd, which is people who have ADHD tendencies but they haven't had it bad enough to get a diagnosis, then that number climbs even higher. And at that point you're sort of getting into a position where you're saying, okay, it's rarer to find someone who doesn't struggle with these particular systems. And, and that's what I do. I work with people undiagnosed, diagnosed, subclinical, that kind of thing.
05:02
Jack Jostes
What, what's the difference between ADD and adhd?
05:07
Skye Waterson
It's just how it presents. So you can have ADHD type, you know, the, so it's called Type 1 and Type 2 now, but I'll use the other terminology. It's just easier. ADHD is like hyperactivity primarily. And then ADD is more inattentive. Presentation, so getting distracted, not paying attention, that kind of thing. And then you can have combined, which is what I have. I have the good old. Does both of them adhd.
05:36
Jack Jostes
And why is it that so many entrepreneurs have adhd? Why do you think that is? Is it, is it because it's harder to work for other people? Because it's. Is that it or is it, you know, I think there's, there's gifts. I want to, I want to talk about the bright side of adhd, but I'm just curious, why do you think that? Whether it's 50 times or 300 times, like, why? Why?
06:10
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so it's one of those situations. So basically it's a combination like you sort of hinted at here when you look at the research, what we find is that people who have ADHD or ADD are more likely to start something, like start something entrepreneurial. They struggle with the scaling part, but they're more likely to start. And that starting has to do with impulsivity, which is a big part of adhd, can also be, you know, good because it means you jump on an opportunity, you jump on something before it really, you know, you're like, how hard can it be? Let's do it. Like, let's just say, yep, I'll do this job. And now you've started something. It can also be creative thinking outside of the box thinking, which is a strength of adhd, really works in this environment.
06:55
Skye Waterson
But then on the other hand, that creative thinking, that out of the box thinking isn't always appreciated in a workplace. And so when you think about the structure of work versus doing your own thing, we just seem to be prime, really well suited for the entrepreneurial life.
Why Scaling Is Harder Than Starting
07:15
Jack Jostes
How, how do you coach people who maybe they are entrepreneurial, they are very creative thinking, they are very good at starting things, maybe they've started their own business. But you say they struggle at scaling. So what are some of the ways that you coach people to work through that while still having that gift and that creativity and that out of the box thinking?
07:39
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so I will say I don't just coach people anymore. And I think that's an important distinction. So what I do is because, because, you know, you give people great advice and they're like, that's awesome. How do It? You know, so what we do is we actually come in and I will work with the founder and sort of go through and say, okay, this is how your brain works. This is your particular issue? Sometimes there's specific issues. Like I've had clients go from I can't send an email to pursuing leads, no problem just by switching them to an audio to tech system. Like, little things like that can be really helpful. And so I come in, I build them a flow of like, this is where you are here. This is what your business looks like when it's operationalized completely.
08:25
Skye Waterson
And I take them through that process of, you know, standard coaching stuff. How does, how does your brain work? What do you need? Trying to get everything out of their head as well about how their business works. Because for a lot of operators, especially in a space like landscaping, it's all in their head because they're doing it themselves. And then when it comes to, okay, we need you to hire your first person, then our team actually go through and help with that process. So if it's a local hire, we'll help, we'll work with the recruiter. You know, do the, you know, say we need a test project. There's a specific way that is very good for hiring in general and extra good for adhd.
09:04
Skye Waterson
So we take people through that process and then once somebody's in your business, then we go, okay, now we know what you've been struggling with. We're going to teach you how to deal with it, but we're also going to start handing pieces of it off to this other person. And that combination has been the most effective, especially with very, very busy entrepreneurs who really just want to work in their zone of genius. And so often it's about figuring out what that is. Like you started this because you're good at something, you're good at the work, or you're good at coming up with new ways to do landscaping. I've worked with some wonderfully creative landscapers. And it's now we're going in and saying, okay, how do we take everything else off your plate?
09:04
09:46
Jack Jostes
And so are you working mainly with business owners who are just getting maybe their first employees. So there may be a little smaller.
09:55
Skye Waterson
Businesses sort of, to be completely honest with you, and this is an ADHD thing, I'm working with business owners who should have gotten their employee, their first employees like $100,000 ago. Like, you know, I'm working with the business own, like my business is, you know, at the million dollar mark even, or maybe they've hired a couple of people, but it's just not working really well. Or they're scaling beyond what they can handle, but they've still been Doing it for ages, and they need to get off the tools and actually, you know, do other things. Those are. Those are the people I work with.
Communication Problems ADHD Business Owners Face
10:27
Jack Jostes
What. What are some of the challenges specifically about hiring other people that landscapers with ADHD may face?
10:37
Skye Waterson
There's a big struggle with communication. So when we look at the research, what we find is that when you are somebody who has adhd, the way that you communicate, just the physical, like, way that you talk, is not as. It's not the same as the way someone who's more neurotypical. So someone who doesn't have ADHD or ADHD symptoms talks to the point where an AI language model can distinguish someone who's got ADHD symptoms from somebody who doesn't, just based on the way they talk. So even at that basic level, what that means is that the communication is really off. And so what tends to happen as a result is when you look at the research, people say, find that if you talk to somebody else with adhd, they get you.
11:23
Skye Waterson
They're like a, B, F. Who cares about, you know, cd we don't need all those steps. And so you end up hiring other people who are like you because they think like you and they work like you, and they're happy. Happy to be in chaos. But now everyone's in chaos. Everyone likes chaos. No one's an operator because nobody's learned how to communicate with an operator.
11:46
Jack Jostes
So when. Yeah, when you mentioned LLMs, I was thinking about how to use LLMs to translate things. I often feel like I'm a translator at my company, not necessarily between people who have adhd. They may have it, they may not. I don't know. But I use AI to translate things. And then I. I will also use disc profile. So I'll. I. I may find that two of my employees are like, they're. I'm just seeing them not communicate. And I might upload both of their disc, their personality assessments to an AI tool and find ways to kind of translate to each other. So that's one of the ways I'm using it. I was curious, what are some of the steps or things maybe people listening? They're like, yeah, that's me. I'm a really creative, entrepreneurial person, and I do struggle with communicating with other people.
12:47
Jack Jostes
What are some of the things maybe that listeners could try to improve that?
12:53
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so the first one I'd say is the brief gap. So one of the things that will often happen is an entrepreneur will say they'll have, you know, they'll have some people on their team. And they'll be like, right, we're going to do this new thing. It's going to be awesome. We're going to have a meeting, we're going to discuss it and then we're going to make it, you know, do it, add it to the business. And so they'll come in, they'll be very enthusiastic, they'll have an idea, they'll say it. They think they've communicated it effectively to their team. Their team is kind of taking it on board. Okay, we'll think about it. Let's, let's get it started.
13:27
Skye Waterson
And then they'll come back in a couple of weeks and they will have built something that the owner, the person who started with this is like, that isn't at all what I said. Like, are these guys good? Do they know what they're doing? And this can happen a lot. And so the thing that you can do, the real easy switch for this is that when you look with people who have ADHD symptoms, they're just not communicating in the detail that they need to. You're not going to be able to easily help them to do that unless they sit down and like talk to an AI for half an hour or write it down laboriously by themselves. What you need to do instead. So it's super simple.
14:03
Skye Waterson
Before the meeting, they just need to send like a voice note or a quick email or a quick text message or something to the team with a high level outline of what they want to be set up in the business. And then when they have the meeting, the people that they're meeting with, whether it's one person or a group of people, needs to bring them things to react to. Like, okay, based on what you said, I made a really quick like outline of the flow. I. This is the kind of thing that I think it looks like, you know, if we're doing a landscaping thing, like this is what I think you want me to do. I've like drawn it out, you know, something very basic, like rough as heck.
14:42
Skye Waterson
And then that will give the owner way more information to be able to easily react to and you get a much better processed that way.
A Better Way To Run Team Meetings
14:52
Jack Jostes
So. So you're saying the owner would send something to the team ahead of time, like a video or a voice memo.
14:59
Skye Waterson
Exactly.
15:00
Jack Jostes
And giving those people some time to review it and then they meet.
15:04
Skye Waterson
Yep, exactly. It saves a ton of why doesn't my team understand what I'm doing? Frustration.
15:12
Jack Jostes
Yeah, yeah, that's. I like it I'm thinking that, you know, we do something similar to that at Ramblin Jackson. We use Loom videos a lot and then we have a written agenda for our meetings. So there's a Google Doc where people can type, there's a video. And I found that help, I think helps people feel on the same page and get it. And I do. I'm actually, I just recorded a video I do every quarter. I use Traction, I use eos, and I find that helps me filter through all the ideas to prioritize. What are we doing? What are the rocks? That's been a system for me that, you know, I think the book Traction talks about having 20 great ideas to come up with one viable idea. And that whole system has worked for me. What, what works for you?
16:10
Jack Jostes
And what is the prioritization filter?
The Prioritization Filter Explained
16:15
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so let's go into that. So those are kind of some of the invisible systems that you have once you have a team. But if it's just you. And often when I'm working with people, the first thing we have to do is we kind of have to like, we have to, I guess so the ground, like we have to, you know, get the ground prepared basically to have people in the business. And one of the things we deal with is the idea of, okay, that's cool, but like, I have a million things I have to do today. I'm not even going to send a single email that I like. I'm just completely full with work. There's so much stuff I need to do. I don't even know how to start thinking about it. And so we've developed a prioritization filter.
16:54
Skye Waterson
It's based on how our brains work. And there's a couple of steps to it. And you can, you know, you can DM me at Unconventional organization if you want, the GBT that takes you through this and the notion Dashboard that helps you build it out. But I can also just, I'm also just going to tell you so you're going to be able to use it. From, from what I'm saying, the first thing that we want to do is we want to go ahead and we want to just brain dump everything that is in our brains right now. So we want to write it down or use voice to text or whatever we want to do, just get everything out because our working memory is not big enough to hold everything that's in our brains and also do this exercise.
17:36
Skye Waterson
We want to get that out on something. Ideally, we're going to reuse, like, not a random piece of paper. I know we love a random piece of paper, but please try not to use one. And then from there, we're going to look at everything and we're going to say, okay, what is truly urgent in the next 24 hours? And by truly urgent, I mean if I was in. If my day went sideways and I ended up in a waiting room for the next 24 hours and I couldn't do anything, I couldn't go anywhere, what would I still be doing on my phone? Or what would I have to message someone and say, hey, I can't come tomorrow because I'm not prepared because I didn't do the thing I had to do today for the thing tomorrow.
18:14
Skye Waterson
Like, those are truly urgent tasks for the next 24 hours. So I ask people to just go through and put a little star next to those. Once you've done that, you'll find everybody finds this. You have less than five truly urgent things to do that day. It's very small number of things that fits in that space, which is normal. We want that. Because what we want to do is we want to show you how much space you actually do have. And then from there we go in and we say, okay, well, what is urgent in the next seven days? Like, let's say it's a bit of a random metaphor at this point, but let's say you were in a waiting room for seven days. Like, what would you have to do when you were in that space?
18:54
Skye Waterson
And that then allows us to say, okay, these are the things. These are the under five things I have to do today. These are the, like, 10 things I have to do this week. Okay, cool. This then allows me to go, what is the one or two things that, if you worked on them, they would transform your business? You're like, I need to hire somebody for this role. I need to finish this process. I need to. I need to build a quote system that means that I'm actually doing quotes, and I'm not just reactively sometimes doing them and sometimes forgetting them and putting them off. Things like that are making really big differences in these kind of businesses. Okay, let's block out some time to do one to maximum three of them this week.
19:40
Skye Waterson
Now, we know we don't have a ton of urgent stuff. We have that space to be able to do that. And for most people, that exercise. And this is a. It's a really deep exercise. Like, I've worked with people who, you know, it goes a lot more Deep. We can introduce delegation and a whole bunch of other pieces to it. But at its core, that's the exercise that allows you to go from. Everything is overwhelming, I don't know what I'm doing, to breaking it down.
19:40
Tools And Systems For Organizing Ideas
20:05
Jack Jostes
I like it. I like it. And I'm thinking as I. So part of what I'm doing, I'm writing notes and I have a notebook that. This is how I deal with all the ideas and things, is I need to write things down to focus and then I can reference it and read back at it. But that's, you know, talking about reusable paper. I've been using this notebook for like 15 years. I have. I actually am throwing them out now for some reason. I'm looking at them on my shelf and I'm like, I don't really need these notes from whatever I did 10 years ago. But what's. What, what do you use? How do I. In your. In your own personal.
20:51
Skye Waterson
I was like, do you have. I use this. This is a remarkable. Have you ever seen one of these?
20:56
Jack Jostes
I have and I haven't. I haven't tried one. Do you like it? Like it?
21:02
Skye Waterson
Yeah. So I got this one. This is an old. This is like the og. I've got another one, but this is the OG one. And I got this during my degree. I got this so early on that I had like unlimited storage because I was one of the early adopters. And it's awesome. Like, I was the same. I had so many notebooks, it was taking forever. What I like about this is it's not connected to the Internet, but it is connected to Dropbox or One Drive. And so what I have, and these are the kind of systems I build for other people, is I have my EA send me anything that I need to sign off on or review to my drive, like into a little remarkable inbox. I look at that, I see what I need to do.
21:45
Skye Waterson
And then I can just work away from the Internet on this device and then send it, email it to my. My email, and then my EA can take it and run with that. So it allows me to work off the computer.
21:59
Jack Jostes
That's pretty cool. I didn't know you could do that with that.
22:02
Skye Waterson
Yeah, yeah, we know. This is. This is what I do for a living. So I love all these little systems.
Understanding The Dopamine Dial
22:08
Jack Jostes
That's cool. So what is. What is the dopamine dial? I read this in some of your blogs. Different things. What, what is. First of all, what is dopamine? What does it have to do with ADHD and Then what is the dopamine dial?
22:25
Skye Waterson
Yeah, so I'll give you the high level answer. So essentially one of the issues that we seem to have with ADHD is we have a bit of struggle with how we process dopamine. So, like whether we access it incorrectly or whether we have less, you know, the neuroscientists are still figuring that out, but we know that there's an issue with dopamine. And dopamine is essentially a chemical that is related to rewards and feeling good and feeling positive. So if you're somebody who doesn't have adhd, for example, then you might start a task and immediately get a feel good boost of like, yes, I started the task and I'm working on the task. And that's awesome. And that's why people often say, just start, you'll feel so much better once you start it.
23:08
Skye Waterson
But if you struggle with adhd, what we seem to find is that you are not going to get that boost. It doesn't work in the same way. And so your brain just goes, I don't like this. This is boring. I don't want to do this. And then at the end, when you're supposed to feel like, yeah, and here's the reward at the end, which is tied to the thing you did, our brain just goes, and now I have to do this other thing. And that sucks too. So it doesn't really connect and the reward doesn't really connect. So what we do instead in terms of the dopamine dial is we want to go ahead and we want to dial our dopamine down.
23:47
Skye Waterson
So what this looks like, if you imagine one of those big old dials, is if you want to do a task that you don't, if you have to sit down and do a task you don't want to do, then we go in and we say, okay, what is the level of dopamine that would make you feel like you wanted to do it? So, you know, a good example is if I said to you have to fill out this form, and you were like, oh, like, I really don't want to do that. That's so boring. And I said, okay, you don't have to do it, but you could do it on a tropical island in a hammock drinking your favorite drink, there's music playing, there's the perfect amount of breeze, and you've got your laptop and you just have to fill out the form.
24:26
Skye Waterson
Do you want to do it now? And for most people, the answer is going to be, yeah, that sounds Like a holiday. Yes, I would like to do that now, please. And so we want to take that idea and go in and say, okay, what's the level at which you're going to want to do this? Like, what other things can we do? Can we do coffee shop? Can we do. You know, food is a thing that people talk about. We try to do less than that. Like, what is the environment, what is the sounds, what is the taste, what is the. You know, things like that's going to make you want to do it. And then we slowly move it down. So now you've opened the document, you're working on it, the coffee is finished, but you're still on the cafe.
25:02
Skye Waterson
So that's kind of interesting. And then, you know, you've got music on, but then maybe the music gets too annoying as you start working, and so you turn the music off, and now you're just in a cafe working. So we want to dial the dopamine down, but we don't want to turn it off because if we turn it off, it's too boring. It's. It's like almost painful doing tasks.
ADHD Medication, Exercise, And Focus
25:20
Jack Jostes
So. So people who. People deliberately think about this when they're about to do a task they'd otherwise put off.
25:30
Skye Waterson
Yeah, yeah. I, I wrote about this because I didn't. We. You know, there's a conversation about dopamine detoxing, and I was like, oh, this just feels like punishment for people who are already struggling. Like, it doesn't necessarily get why you want to do it, but I'm not totally sure if this is a good idea based on the research. And so I wrote that article on the dopamine dial on my substack, and it went crazy. Like, it still gets. I still get messages from people saying, I've tried this. It really helped. Like, I feel like I'm actually getting things done, so it's been very effective.
26:01
Jack Jostes
What, what are your thoughts about ADHD medicine? I'll. I'll share my. My experience was being told, you need to take this medicine. And I did around age 6. And then around in high school, I was like, you know what? I don't like taking this. I don't want to have to take something forever. And I'm not saying that medicine isn't right for some people. I know that I have a best friend who totally disagrees with me on this, and he's like, medicine is the key to helping me with this, so I don't necessarily have a dog in the fight, but I'm just curious what's your sense on it and are people over medicalized and are there, are they taught these other coping mechanisms, some of the things that you're talking about?
26:52
Skye Waterson
It's a good question. So I, I don't take medication either. I just didn't. And then I had kids, so I didn't. And then I decided this business so I was like, well, let me be as ADHD as possible so I can, you know, help other people with systems and strategies. So I don't take medication, but I know a lot of people who do. And you know, I personally feel like whatever works for your family is going to be right, you know, But I see it as a suite of tools. So when we look at the research, for example, we look at, okay, what actually works for ADHD based on the research, you know, we've got all of the studies.
27:25
Skye Waterson
One of the most effective things is exercise, like moving your body is based on the research like, you know, studied over a long time, multiple systems. We're as close to saying exercise definitely helps as we can be in an academic sense.
27:42
Jack Jostes
What about protein?
27:44
Skye Waterson
I do not know about protein. I get asked about protein, I get asked about fiber, I get asked about guts. And, and that one I do not have answer to.
27:54
Jack Jostes
Well, I, I'll, you know, from what I found is that, you know, when people don't eat enough protein, you know, and somebody who does a lot of research this is Dr. Mark Hyman. Do you know, I don't know if you've, if you follow him at all, but that's one of the key things that he focuses on. And I don't want to quote, I don't have one of his articles in front of me, but that essentially that when people are protein deficient, it causes anxiety, depression, lack of focus, all these other things that I found. Just when I focus on exercise and protein, my ability to focus, get things done, feel good, is so much higher. And when I don't, the dark side of ADHD of getting super distracted or hyperactive is just rampant for me.
28:48
Jack Jostes
So that's what I found is exercise for me is essential to it and then also protein as well. And, and I don't, and I don't, I'm partly bringing it up. Cause I don't remember anyone when I was a kid ever asking me like, so how much do you exercise and tell me what you eat and how much do you sleep and all these like basic life things that contribute to if you have ADHD or whatever else going on making it so much worse, a hundred percent.
28:48
29:21
Skye Waterson
And that's one of the reasons I love working one one with, with owners. I had an owner a couple of weeks ago and he was like, really stressed out and he was like, I think this business is, oh, I don't know, it's not good. And I knew the business was going well and so we looked into it and I was like, you need to start moving more. Like you have been in winter, you haven't been moving enough. And like, I'm going to like, send you a message every day to be like, hey, have you done it? Have you gone for a walk? Have you gone outside? And two weeks later, he feels amazing. So, you know, it's, it is really crucial that you keep those baselines in mind for sure.
“Being As ADHD As Possible”
29:58
Jack Jostes
So, so you just said something a minute ago that you don't take medication for it because you want. You said, let me be as ADHD as possible and you grinned a bit. So tell. Yeah, so tell me, like, what does that mean to you?
30:13
Skye Waterson
I just mean that, you know, for me, I don't drink coffee, I don't take medication and I, you know, I move, I exercise, I get sleep, I do all that kind of stuff. But every time I am frustrated by my own ADHD struggles, it is a opportunity for me to figure out how to find a solution for these struggles. Like, a lot, most of the things I teach now, you know, formerly as an academic and now as a business owner, working with business owners, it's based on stuff that I have struggled with. And my husband, he has add. So, you know, we've been there. And that's part of the reason why what we do is so interesting to people.
30:58
Jack Jostes
So, so it, for you, it being as ADHD as possible is partly being creative? Is that what you're saying?
31:06
Skye Waterson
Or is it something I would say? I would say that it's like, it's funny, no one's ever asked me this question. It's. I would say that it is me understanding just how frustrating it is to want to do something and struggle with all of the executive functioning issues. You know, I want to do it, but I have working memory. I have shiny object syndrome, I have, you know, time blindness. Like, I have all of the things that we talk about with adhd and I don't have anything helping me outside of sleep and exercise to reduce that. So if I am using systems and they are working that to me, is an indication. So the way I do it is I research how ADHD works.
31:50
Skye Waterson
I try these systems usually on myself first, then I introduce them to my one one clients as and when they're needed. And then I introduce them to the wider community and the podcast and things like that. So it allows that flow to happen.
Neurodiversity As A Business Advantage
32:06
Jack Jostes
I love it. One of the books that I read was called Rainbow Brain. Have you heard of that one? It's actually a kids book. Yeah. So it's about neurodiversity and they have. You should, you should check it out. You should, or even Google it. You'll see the illustrations from it. And it talks about adhd, it talks about anxiety, it talks about autism, it talks about dyslexia. And it's meant for kids to read, to kind of understand when they're, when they hear, oh, this person has dyslexia or whatever. And, and it was just an interesting book. I wanted to see if you had read because it painted it though, as a rainbow brain. And these are different things in a positive way of, like, these are gifts and they can be gifts, and they also come with challenges too.
33:06
Jack Jostes
So I think part of it was just reading about that and understanding when I'm working with somebody who, you know, actually I had a landscaper here who was very embarrassed to tell me that he had dyslexia. And he was designing something for my yard. And I live in the Rocky Mountains on a very steep grade, and I had to remove this giant pine tree, and there's this concrete area that I didn't want to remove, and we had to create a patio space. And he just came in and like, looked and was like, oh, yeah, we're going to do this and why don't we put a step here? And I never would have thought of putting a step where he did, but it was a brilliant idea to create these steps down to what's now a patio.
33:54
Jack Jostes
And I was like, man, I never would have thought about that. So to me, it was like seeing him do what he does so well. And, and he's like, meanwhile embarrassed about having dyslexia. And I'm like, no, man, this is a gift. You, you can go and design these spaces and solve these, you know, spatial problems. Like, I, I'm not gifted in that way. I appreciate people who are partly just because I'm like, oh, I can't do that, but you can.
34:28
Skye Waterson
Yeah, no, it's amazing and it's great to see And I think a lot of times it really sucks that a lot of people who have those abilities, like, quit because they. They just can't figure out the other side of it. Like, they've got this genius, but they can't figure out the systems or how to get cash flow, anything like that.
Resources For Landscapers With ADHD
34:47
Jack Jostes
Yeah. Well, Sky Waterson, thanks for coming on the Landscapers Guide. Do you have any resources you want to share or final questions or comments before we wrap up today?
35:00
Skye Waterson
Yeah. Yeah. Well, you can. So you can find me at unconventional organization anywhere with. You can find me with an S, although we do have it with the Z now as well. On Instagram, on LinkedIn, or on just on the Internet. You can find my podcast, the ADHD Skills Lab. We talk about ADHD in business and we get into the nitty gritty of all of that. And if you want my prioritization filter, you can just DM me prioritize on Instagram. And if you're interested in having somebody build these operational systems for you in a way that works for your brain, you can just DM me invisible on Instagram as well. And we'll see if you're a fit for what we do.
35:41
Jack Jostes
Cool. Well, Sky, I'm going to put links to everything you just mentioned in our show notes. And thanks again for coming on the Landscapers Guide.
35:48
Skye Waterson
No worries. It was great.